Who ReJumps?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by SAJ

sigh...same result

case book play talks about dual touching oob as well...dual touching oob/dual touching ib....same procedure

sigh....rule 7-3-2 as cited by yourself wasn't relevant to the situation posted. Right answer---->wrong rule cited to back it up.

Kelvin gave the correct rules citation....and that was both his & my point.

[SAJ]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

sigh....rule 7-3-2 as cited by yourself wasn't relevant to the situation posted. Right answer---->wrong rule cited to back it up.

Kelvin gave the correct rules citation....and that was both his & my point.

I guess I don't see where I'm wrong. Both are based on the rule 7-3-2. Where in the rule book is the held ball situation as presented defined? I don't think it explicitly states it except in 7-3-2 as I posted.

Either way, both have ultimately given the OP a correct ruling on the play in question. I'm fine with that.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by SAJ

I guess I don't see where I'm wrong. Both are based on the rule 7-3-2. Where in the rule book is the held ball situation as presented defined? I don't think it explicitly states it except in 7-3-2 as I posted.

Either way, both have ultimately given the OP a correct ruling on the play in question. I'm fine with that.

7-3-2 is the rule for out of bounds. It works if two players simultaneously cause the ball to go out of bounds; it doesn't work for a held ball. Sure, you could use it and go with the precedent if you had to, but you don't have to because of rule 6-4-3(note). More specifically, consider 6-4-3a (held ball), and the note below all of 6-4-3, "If the alternating possession procedure has not been established, the jump ball shall be between the two players involved in the center restraining circle."

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by SAJ

I guess I don't see where I'm wrong. Both are based on the rule 7-3-2. Where in the rule book is the held ball situation as presented defined? I don't think it explicitly states it except in 7-3-2 as I posted.

Either way, both have ultimately given the OP a correct ruling on the play in question. I'm fine with that.

Rule 7-3-2 tells us what to call if the ball is simultaneously touched and then goes OOB(as in rule 7-3-1) and the AP procedure is not yet established.

The situation being discussed in the original post was a completely different situation that the one outlined in 7-3-1. The situation being discussed was dual possession after a jump ball without the ball going OOB, and also with no AP procedure being set yet.

Apples and oranges....and 2 completely different situations.

Both situations are handled the exact same way but each different situation also has a different rule citation to back up their respective calls.

You got the call right but the rule citation that you used was wrong iow. You used a rule citation that is valid for a completely different situation. That's all that was being pointed out.

The correct rules citation for what to do for a held ball off an an opening jump ball as discussed in the original post is rule 6-4-3(a)NOTE, not rule 7-3-2.....even though they both have the exact same result.

No biggie anyway. I think the idea has been gotten across already anyway.

EDIT: or as what Snaqs said...

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by SAJ

I guess I don't see where I'm wrong. Both are based on the rule 7-3-2. Where in the rule book is the held ball situation as presented defined? I don't think it explicitly states it except in 7-3-2 as I posted.

Either way, both have ultimately given the OP a correct ruling on the play in question. I'm fine with that.

This is like saying that there's no difference between illegal dribble and traveling because the penalty for both is a throw-in.

[SAJ]

Originally Posted by mbyron

This is like saying that there's no difference between illegal dribble and traveling because the penalty for both is a throw-in.

My point, I guess terribly made, is that these are jump ball procedures with no alternating possession arrow currently set. Call em apples and oranges if you want.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by SAJ

My point, I guess terribly made, is that these are jump ball procedures with no alternating possession arrow currently set. Call em apples and oranges if you want.

If you stuck to original OP, that's what we were looking for. You meandered a little, but all is clear for both situations.

[sseltser]

Originally Posted by SAJ

My point, I guess terribly made, is that these are jump ball procedures with no alternating possession arrow currently set. Call em apples and oranges if you want.

So for this play:

Jump ball tipped by A1 into A's backcourt. A2 and B2 chase after it and A2 and B2 simultaneously foul each other.

Must A2 and B2 re-jump? Are they "the two player's involved" as in 6-4-3-Note? Does the "two player's involved" mean the jumpers (and the Note is just pointing out the location), or the players who caused the tie-up, double foul, double violation, simultaneous OOB?

Back to my play: What if the foul disqualifies one or both of the players (either 5th foul during OT, or double flagrant)? Must their substitutes re-jump?

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by sseltser

So for this play:

Jump ball tipped by A1 into A's backcourt. A2 and B2 chase after it and A2 and B2 simultaneously foul each other.

Must A2 and B2 re-jump? Are they "the two player's involved" as in 6-4-3-Note? Does the "two player's involved" mean the jumpers (and the Note is just pointing out the location), or the players who caused the tie-up, double foul, double violation, simultaneous OOB?

Back to my play: What if the foul disqualifies one or both of the players (either 5th foul during OT, or double flagrant)? Must their substitutes re-jump?

Yep...A2 and B2 jump....and the player's sub if DQd.

[Zoochy]

I'd never thought this post would have generated so many replies. The original play occured in a State post season girls game in Missouri. Sorry to say, the 3 officials did not apply the correct ruling. They placed A1 and B1 back in the jump circle. This play did not decide the outcome of the game, but it is good to know the in's and out's of the rules of basketball.