Have you seen these slow motion examples of traveling?

[Paul LeBoutillier]

I thought this was interesting

YouTube - Violations?

[JRutledge]

If you have to slow things down that much to see if there is a violation, then they are not good calls to make.

Peace

[Paul LeBoutillier]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If you have to slow things down that much to see if there is a violation, then they are not good calls to make.

I'm not really sure what you mean, Rut. I can't speak for whomever made the video but it seems he slowed it down to highlight the violations rather than to merely see them. Don't you think slowing down the video helps a Ref to be able to identify this type of violation especially in light of the fact that these kinds of violations were Points of Emphasis?

Paul

[jeffpea]

only the last play was traveling....

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Paul LeBoutillier

I'm not really sure what you mean, Rut. I can't speak for whomever made the video but it seems he slowed it down to highlight the violations rather than to merely see them. Don't you think slowing down the video helps a Ref to be able to identify this type of violation especially in light of the fact that these kinds of violations were Points of Emphasis?

Paul

I agree with Jeff here. The only one that looked like a violation was the last one. A dribble was staring as the pivot feet moved on the others. The ball does not have to touch the floor, just the dribble has to start.

Peace

[Paul LeBoutillier]

Again, it wasn't my video, but weren't those fairly clear examples of lifting the pivot foot prior to releasing the ball?

[hayblue99]

If you want to watch rules and plays watch these for a while; Dartfish.tv - Channel NFHS Basketball Officials Education Channel

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Paul LeBoutillier

Again, it wasn't my video, but weren't those fairly clear examples of lifting the pivot foot prior to releasing the ball?

No.

Peace

[deecee]

Originally Posted by Paul LeBoutillier

Again, it wasn't my video, but weren't those fairly clear examples of lifting the pivot foot prior to releasing the ball?

no they were not clear examples. As a rule of thumb if you have to slow down a video that much to see a very close to borderline call then its not a good call to make (just like Rut said earlier).

I have been told many times that not to call the borderline travels and stick with the very obvious ones. Why? Because at the mens level sometimes things happen so fast we dont get to go to video for each call. So who cares about these super slow motion examples of travelling.

[Pantherdreams]

I don't have a travel on the very first one but I don't have a clear enough line on when the ball leaves his hand.

The next one looks really bad once you slow it down, but at game speed if you are calling that one then you will be blowing a lot of stuff in a high school game if you intend on being consistent.

The last two are a little easier to call based on the landing footowork and then take off footwork. In both cases there is a lot of changing pivot foot and slow release of the ball going on.

But again if you plan on calling all these all night, my guess is in most high school age games and below you'll be calling a travel every 2 or 3 possesions on someone.

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If you have to slow things down that much to see if there is a violation, then they are not good calls to make.

Peace

I agree with Jeff as far as IF you have to slow things down this much to see, it probably is not a good call to make. On the other hand, I think that the use of slow motion video can be very effective as a learning tool.

For example, many spin moves and other moves with the ball "don't look right", yet, we should NOT make a travel call simply because it "looks" like a travel. We can make use of slow motion replays to view those types of plays to be able to ascertain when there IS a bonafide travel and when a play that "looks" like one actually isn't.

Once we realize a strange looking play is/isn't a travel in slow motion, we can look at that same play at real speed KNOWING whether it is or isn't a travel to better train our eyes to ONLY make the travel call when the play "looks" like a travel and ACTUALLY IS a travel.

[Rich]

Even slowed down, I only have a travel on the last one. The ball only needs to start to the floor before the pivot foot is lifted. I think that's satisfied well enough on the others. At real speed (where we work) these don't look even close to being traveling violations.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

I agree with Jeff as far as IF you have to slow things down this much to see, it probably is not a good call to make. On the other hand, I think that the use of slow motion video can be very effective as a learning tool.

For example, many spin moves and other moves with the ball "don't look right", yet, we should NOT make a travel call simply because it "looks" like a travel. We can make use of slow motion replays to view those types of plays to be able to ascertain when there IS a bonafide travel and when a play that "looks" like one actually isn't.

Once we realize a strange looking play is/isn't a travel in slow motion, we can look at that same play at real speed KNOWING whether it is or isn't a travel to better train our eyes to ONLY make the travel call when the play "looks" like a travel and ACTUALLY IS a travel.

I did not say you cannot slow things down on video to see a play. I said that if you have to slow things down and that is the only way to determine by a split second if an actual violation takes place, then in reality it is not a good call. I use video replay all the time in classes or meetings and it is often that we might get a slow motion replay. If I have to look to see if a pivot foot moved slightly before the ball was released, then I think you will have a lot of travels in fast speed that might be wrong or inconsistent. Now I call a lot of these kinds of travels where the pivot foot is moved before a dribble, but those are very obvious and I would not need a tape to call those. You want to call the obvious travels, not what looks slightly bad.

Peace

[coachgbert]

Originally Posted by hayblue99

If you want to watch rules and plays watch these for a while; Dartfish.tv - Channel NFHS Basketball Officials Education Channel

Thanks from a coach! This should be mandatory for all coaches to watch too!

Coach Gbert

[Adam]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Even slowed down, I only have a travel on the last one. The ball only needs to start to the floor before the pivot foot is lifted. I think that's satisfied well enough on the others. At real speed (where we work) these don't look even close to being traveling violations.

Doesn't it have to be released? I haven't seen the video, but this statement made me think I might have the rule wrong.