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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:01pm
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block/charge by rule
Our situation the other night had A1 throwing the ball on an inbounds in the backcourt. He threw the ball in the air and while in the air A2 caught the ball with B1 gaining legal guarding position and before A2 landed he crashed into B1. My question comes with do you have to give time and distance when player A2 left the floor without the ball. Or when he gains possession in the air you no longer have to give time and distance?
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:07pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitveer View Post
Our situation the other night had A1 throwing the ball on an inbounds in the backcourt. He threw the ball in the air and while in the air A2 caught the ball with B1 gaining legal guarding position and before A2 landed he crashed into B1. My question comes with do you have to give time and distance when player A2 left the floor without the ball. Or when he gains possession in the air you no longer have to give time and distance?
I would have a Block on B1. A2 is entitled to return to the floor even though B1 had LGP which again was after A2 left the floor.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:08pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitveer View Post
Our situation the other night had A1 throwing the ball on an inbounds in the backcourt. He threw the ball in the air and while in the air A2 caught the ball with B1 gaining legal guarding position and before A2 landed he crashed into B1. My question comes with do you have to give time and distance when player A2 left the floor without the ball. Or when he gains possession in the air you no longer have to give time and distance?
Time and distance are not required, by rule, when guarding the player with the ball. How long he had had the ball isn't relevant.

What is relevant and unclear, however, is whether B1 got to his spot prior to A2 going airborne. Once A2 is airborne, B1 cannot gain LGP within the airborne path of A2.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:10pm
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Whether he has the ball or not, he has to have a place to land.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:18pm
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Originally Posted by just another ref View Post
Whether he has the ball or not, he has to have a place to land.
Assuming B1 wasn't in his spot before A2 jumped to catch the ball, you're right. That's not clear from the OP.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:27pm
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Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
Assuming B1 wasn't in his spot before A2 jumped to catch the ball, you're right. That's not clear from the OP.
Correction: Whether he has the ball or not, defender can't move into his landing spot while the player is airborne.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 04:32pm
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Originally Posted by just another ref View Post
Correction: Whether he has the ball or not, defender can't move into his landing spot while the player is airborne.
Right. I'm assuming the defender was there in time due to the OP questioning whether "time and distance" are required. I could be wrong, however. It would be the 2nd time today.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 09:34pm
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Originally Posted by just another ref View Post
Whether he has the ball or not, he has to have a place to land.
Captain Chesley B. "Sully" Sullenberger didn't have a ball, but he found a place to land.
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 09:46pm
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The case book under Rule 10.6.1 talks about this situation. It has a charge if B1 gains legal guarding position before A2 leaves the floor. Or, if he moves into legal guarding position while A2 is in the air then A2 lands and crashes. I assume by the case book that time and distance are not required because A2 gains possession of the ball in the air. I just can't find it anywhere that time and distance are required. The fact that A2 is in the air makes no bearing on time and distance once he gains player control. Can any of you find where this would be said under the rules?
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Old Thu Feb 11, 2010, 11:04pm
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Yep, 4-23-4
It's this exact situation.
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Old Fri Feb 12, 2010, 07:40am
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Originally Posted by splitveer View Post
... Or, if he moves into legal guarding position while A2 is in the air then A2 lands and crashes....
This is not possible. How you gain LGP on someone who is airborne?
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Old Fri Feb 12, 2010, 09:00am
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Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
This is not possible. How you gain LGP on someone who is airborne?
By facing them with two feet on the floor AND by giving them space to land.

If A2 landed on B2, then it's a block. IF A2 landed and THEN crashed into B2, it's a charge.
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Old Fri Feb 12, 2010, 09:08am
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Originally Posted by bob jenkins View Post
By facing them with two feet on the floor AND by giving them space to land.

If A2 landed on B2, then it's a block. IF A2 landed and THEN crashed into B2, it's a charge.
Which means LGP isn't established until A2 is no longer airborne.
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Old Fri Feb 12, 2010, 09:20am
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Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
Which means LGP isn't established until A2 is no longer airborne.
Disagree.

LGP can be obtained on an airborne player. But, the "spots" on the court where such a position in LGP are fewer than when the player is not airborne.
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Old Fri Feb 12, 2010, 10:52am
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Originally Posted by BadNewsRef View Post
Which means LGP isn't established until A2 is no longer airborne.
I agree with Bob: the specification of how to obtain LGP does not require that the opponent be in contact with the court.
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