Traveling Help!?

[CDurham]

Okay so Traveling is my biggest weakness as an official. I do not have a problem with seeing the pivot foot. But I have a problem in knowing what they can do. I have read the rule book over and over and have watched videos but I just cant seem to grasp it.

Let me see if I can post what I know:

1 - Beginning a dribble the pivot foot has to be on the floor when ball is released?
2- The pivot foot may be lifted but not returned to the floor?
3 - Dribbling, player jumps off of pivot foot and lands on 2 feet, neither can be pivot?

Any I'm missing??

Thanks

[APG]

Originally Posted by CDurham

Okay so Traveling is my biggest weakness as an official. I do not have a problem with seeing the pivot foot. But I have a problem in knowing what they can do. I have read the rule book over and over and have watched videos but I just cant seem to grasp it.

Let me see if I can post what I know:

1 - Beginning a dribble the pivot foot has to be on the floor when ball is released?
2- The pivot foot may be lifted but not returned to the floor?
3 - Dribbling, player jumps off of pivot foot and lands on 2 feet, neither can be pivot?

Any I'm missing??

Thanks

1. Correct. The ball must be released before the pivot foot is lifted.
2. If the pivot foot is lifted, the player must be shoot or pass the ball before the pivot foot is returned to the floor. (Could also request a timeout)
3. If a player gathers the ball with a foot on the ground, they may jump off that foot and must land simultaneously on both feet. They may not pivot after this.

[Juulie Downs]

Originally Posted by AllPurposeGamer

1. Correct. The ball must be released before the pivot foot is lifted.
2. If the pivot foot is lifted, the player must be shoot or pass the ball before the pivot foot is returned to the floor. (Could also request a timeout)
3. If a player gathers the ball with a foot on the ground, they may jump off that foot and must land simultaneously on both feet. They may not pivot after this.

2. If the pivot foot is lifted while the player is holding the ball. Remember, player can do whatever he jolly well pleases with his feet while he's dribbling. I know there's no pivot foot when he's dribbling, but when a person is confused, it's important to keep all the details in mind.

[CDurham]

Originally Posted by Juulie Downs

2. If the pivot foot is lifted while the player is holding the ball. Remember, player can do whatever he jolly well pleases with his feet while he's dribbling. I know there's no pivot foot when he's dribbling, but when a person is confused, it's important to keep all the details in mind.

So if a player gathers the ball with the left foot as the pivot and jumps off the left they cannot land Right then Left? Because the left cannot come down until the ball it released??

What if the left is the pivot and they jump off of the right, is that legal? What can happen after?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by CDurham

So if a player gathers the ball with the left foot as the pivot and jumps off the left they cannot land Right then Left? Because the left cannot come down until the ball it released??

Correct.

Originally Posted by CDurham

What if the left is the pivot and they jump off of the right, is that legal? What can happen after?

Yes, legal. Must pass, shoot, or call timeout before returning to the ground.

[Scratch85]

Originally Posted by CDurham

What if the left is the pivot and they jump off of the right,

This is how most left handed layups are done.

[CDurham]

Originally Posted by Scratch85

This is how most left handed layups are done.

True haha. Never thought of it in that way.

Why is it not traveling when a player has the Left foot as the pivot and they jump off of that foot onto 2 feet? Didn't the Left foot come down again?

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by CDurham

True haha. Never thought of it in that way.

Why is it not traveling when a player has the Left foot as the pivot and they jump off of that foot onto 2 feet? Didn't the Left foot come down again?

Technically there is no pivot foot in this situation (see 4.44.2). Although it might seem counterintuitive, this is specifically allowed by rule. Note this only applies while dribbling or moving, you can't stop, establish a pivot foot and then try to make this move.

[CDurham]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

Technically there is no pivot foot in this situation (see 4.44.2). Although it might seem counterintuitive, this is specifically allowed by rule. Note this only applies while dribbling or moving, you can't stop, establish a pivot foot and then try to make this move.

Okay so catching the ball or dribbling is okay. But if I stop a dribble then try or receive a pass its traveling?

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by CDurham

Okay so catching the ball or dribbling is okay. But if I stop a dribble then try or receive a pass its traveling?

It basically applies to a moving player gathering or receiving the ball, allowing him/her to jump off one foot and land on both simultaneously.

The way I interpret it is that it is all one continuous action, so if the gathering or receiving is one action, and then the jump stop is another, I view it as illegal. Judgement call, though I err on the side of legal if there is doubt.

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by CDurham

Okay so catching the ball or dribbling is okay. But if I stop a dribble then try or receive a pass its traveling?

I'm saying if you stopped a dribble, established a pivot foot, you could not jump off of that pivot foot and land on two feet, that would be travelling. In the case of a jump stop since the player is moving, the foot that they jump off of is not considered to be the pivot foot - there is no pivot foot in that case.

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

It basically applies to a moving player gathering or receiving the ball, allowing him/her to jump off one foot and land on both simultaneously.

The way I interpret it is that it is all one continuous action, so if the gathering or receiving is one action, and then the jump stop is another, I view it as illegal. Judgement call, though I err on the side of legal if there is doubt.

The way I interpret is it gives a moving player an opportunity to come to a stop without requiring that it be "immediate". Imagine how hard it would be if you considered that the foot touching the ground on the catch/gather was the pivot and a player could not lift and return that foot to the ground - in certain situations that move is near impossible, thus the allowance for the jump stop.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

It basically applies to a moving player gathering or receiving the ball, allowing him/her to jump off one foot and land on both simultaneously.

The way I interpret it is that it is all one continuous action, so if the gathering or receiving is one action, and then the jump stop is another, I view it as illegal. Judgement call, though I err on the side of legal if there is doubt.

I disagree. If a player has a foot in the air, I consider them to be moving. Standing on one foot is not a steady-state situation. They may be moving slowly, but they're still moving.

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I disagree. If a player has a foot in the air, I consider them to be moving. Standing on one foot is not a steady-state situation. They may be moving slowly, but they're still moving.

I agree - 4-44-2 does not reference any amount of time limit for the player to be allowed to jump off of that foot and land on both feet. As long as they are moving when they catch/gather the ball and land on one foot, I think you are covered by rule. Although it would not look good..

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

I disagree. If a player has a foot in the air, I consider them to be moving. Standing on one foot is not a steady-state situation. They may be moving slowly, but they're still moving.

This is a valid point, and if you judge the player is still moving then it's all part of that action.

Honestly, I don't think I've ever called a violation for what I described as two separate actions, but I think I would if I judged a player had stopped on one foot, then jumped off it onto two. Would be a pretty awkward, unusual, and strange play.