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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 01:27am
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Correctable Error

Well for the first time I had a correctable error.... uhhhg.

Home team has the ball in the front court. A21 is fouled. Board shows 5 fouls on visiting team.

Ball is put back in play and I take a glance up at the board...it goes from 5 to 7 - crap! Home team is working their offense and HC is saying we should be shooting...home team scores. I kill it and go to the table.

Get it all sorted out and confirm that indeed it was the 7th team foul.

We send A21 to the line to shoot 1&1 with the lane cleared. Makes first, missed second.

V got the ball for spot throw-in on the endline and we continued from there...
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 02:03am
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After 11 years I had my first one ever too. I blame it on the oldest table staff being about 15, and them putting an "extra" foul up 30 seconds after it occurred. On the foul in question, they put it up as the 6th, then after putting ball in play, and a little while later, it goes to 7 team fouls.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 05:04am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjones1 View Post
Well for the first time I had a correctable error.... uhhhg.

Home team has the ball in the front court. A21 is fouled. Board shows 5 fouls on visiting team.

Ball is put back in play and I take a glance up at the board...it goes from 5 to 7 - crap! Home team is working their offense and HC is saying we should be shooting...home team scores. I kill it and go to the table.

Get it all sorted out and confirm that indeed it was the 7th team foul.

We send A21 to the line to shoot 1&1 with the lane cleared. Makes first, missed second.

V got the ball for spot throw-in on the endline and we continued from there...
Was that your POI? I think that you made one small mistake.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 09:45am
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Just a thought, but couldn't you have stopped it when you saw it go from 5 to 7? I'm assuming the offense wasn't in the process of actually scoring.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 09:47am
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In addition to what Nevada said, how long was there between you noticing the foul count at 7 and the home team scoring? Was home in the midst of action going for a score when you saw it or were they just working the ball?

I'm just wondering if there would have been an appropriate to kill the clock before the score. Would have allowed you to shoot the FTs with everyone on the lane and eliminated the double opportunity to score from the foul.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 09:48am
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Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
Just a thought, but couldn't you have stopped it when you saw it go from 5 to 7? I'm assuming the offense wasn't in the process of actually scoring.
You use so many less words than me. Something to work on. For me. In my postings. Because sometimes in trying to explain things I use too many words. And then my meaning isn't clear. Look, a dinosaur!
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 11:48am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
Was that your POI? I think that you made one small mistake.
POI was the made bucket... V was allowed to run the endline but they didn't... as I was the administering official. Good catch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
Just a thought, but couldn't you have stopped it when you saw it go from 5 to 7? I'm assuming the offense wasn't in the process of actually scoring.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdw3018 View Post
In addition to what Nevada said, how long was there between you noticing the foul count at 7 and the home team scoring? Was home in the midst of action going for a score when you saw it or were they just working the ball?

I'm just wondering if there would have been an appropriate to kill the clock before the score. Would have allowed you to shoot the FTs with everyone on the lane and eliminated the double opportunity to score from the foul.
Well, the throw-in spot was on the endline... they made a pass to the block.

If the ball had already been made live and inbounded; I don't think you could have resumed with the free throws and with players in the lane.

Last edited by tjones1; Fri Feb 05, 2010 at 11:50am.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 12:35pm
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Originally Posted by tjones1 View Post
POI was the made bucket... V was allowed to run the endline but they didn't... as I was the administering official. Good catch.





Well, the throw-in spot was on the endline... they made a pass to the block.

If the ball had already been made live and inbounded; I don't think you could have resumed with the free throws and with players in the lane.
Sure you could have, no change of possession had occurred. Line 'em up and shoot. It looks, though, like A scored pretty quickly after you noticed the fouls went up. That'll teach Bs coach to pipe up in that situation, too.

As Bob has said, the incentive seems to be to give everyone an interest in getting it right the first time; because it could end up hurting anyone depending on how it goes down.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 12:43pm
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You should have just shot the 1-1 live. (players on lane) Since their has been no change of possession you don't need to shoot with the lane cleared. I believe case book 2.10.1 E will help you. The case book is about what to do when possession changes and doesn't. In your case you killed the play with the team entitled to the free throws still in possession. So you would just shoot the free-throws like you would normally.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 12:53pm
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Originally Posted by PIAA REF View Post
You should have just shot the 1-1 live. (players on lane) Since their has been no change of possession you don't need to shoot with the lane cleared. I believe case book 2.10.1 E will help you. The case book is about what to do when possession changes and doesn't. In your case you killed the play with the team entitled to the free throws still in possession. So you would just shoot the free-throws like you would normally.
You may want to read rule 8-1-3. I believe that will help you because you are wrong. The lanes are cleared.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 12:59pm
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Originally Posted by PIAA REF View Post
You should have just shot the 1-1 live. (players on lane) Since their has been no change of possession you don't need to shoot with the lane cleared. I believe case book 2.10.1 E will help you. The case book is about what to do when possession changes and doesn't. In your case you killed the play with the team entitled to the free throws still in possession. So you would just shoot the free-throws like you would normally.
Hmmm. A gets a throwin and makes a basket. B is entitled to a throw in now. No change of possession?
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 01:18pm
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He said that he killed the play with the ball still in A's possession after the throw-in for the foul, IF that is the case you shoot the free-throws live. This would be under rule 2-10-6 (this is last yrs book) when correcting merited free throws: if there has been no change in team possession when the error was recognized. The play SHALL resume after free-throw attempts.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 01:21pm
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Never Mind

I didn't catch the home team scores comment.

Bucket counts, clear line, shoot 1-1, player can run endline.
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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 01:27pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PIAA REF View Post
He said that he killed the play with the ball still in A's possession after the throw-in for the foul, IF that is the case you shoot the free-throws live. This would be under rule 2-10-6 (this is last yrs book) when correcting merited free throws: if there has been no change in team possession when the error was recognized. The play SHALL resume after free-throw attempts.
And you're still wrong.

Read rule 9-1-3--"If the ball is to become dead when the last free throw for a specific penalty is not successful, players shall not occupy any spaces along the free-throw lane."

It's that simple.

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Old Fri Feb 05, 2010, 01:31pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PIAA REF View Post
He said that he killed the play with the ball still in A's possession after the throw-in for the foul, IF that is the case you shoot the free-throws live. This would be under rule 2-10-6 (this is last yrs book) when correcting merited free throws: if there has been no change in team possession when the error was recognized. The play SHALL resume after free-throw attempts.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee View Post
And you're still wrong.

Read rule 9-1-3--"If the ball is to become dead when the last free throw for a specific penalty is not successful, players shall not occupy any spaces along the free-throw lane."

It's that simple.

RIF
If Team A had maintained possession are you saying you are going to shoot the free throws then give the ball back to A?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
Sure you could have, no change of possession had occurred. Line 'em up and shoot. It looks, though, like A scored pretty quickly after you noticed the fouls went up. That'll teach Bs coach to pipe up in that situation, too.

As Bob has said, the incentive seems to be to give everyone an interest in getting it right the first time; because it could end up hurting anyone depending on how it goes down.
I call bullcrap on that line of thinking every time. It's just as likely (actually more likely) that A's HC and/or scorekeeper purposely waited for play to resume before notifying the officials.

All game long we want coaches to coach and let us officiate but now all of a sudden a coach is supposed to perform Quality Control for the table and officiating crew.

This particular rule is just plain and simply a bad rule (JAR, where are you when I need you?) Needs to be changed so that if the offended team scores, the timeframe for the CE expires. Right now the offended team's HC has no incentive to identify the error until after his team has had a chance to score extra points.
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Last edited by Raymond; Fri Feb 05, 2010 at 01:34pm.
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