referee has family in high school game

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by fullor30

No, perception is reality IMHO.

So you are saying that if someone thinks there is a conflict, there is a conflict? That opens up a whole lot of cans of worms if that is true.

Peace

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

How far does it go? Should Hartzell be forced to give up working D-I basketball cause he's an AD at a D-I school?

For the record Hartzell left UNI a few years later.

Also a side note to that story. The commentator that raised that issue was ESPN analyst Doug Gottlieb. I actually knew Hartzell's wife as she was an official too and she worked games in front of me at the JUCO level on the Women's side. Well I ran into his wife a few years back at the Big Ten Tournament. She told me that Hartzell took an article in which Referee Magazine wrote about him and the Gottlieb created controversy and Gottlieb was working a game as an analyst. Well Rick Hartzell was officiating and Rick went up to Gottlieb with the article and gave it to Gottlieb before the game started. I guess Gottlieb did not have a lot to say at that point from what I understand.

Originally Posted by RichMSN

And if you look at subvarsity, many schools hire district teachers and local residents to work those games. Nobody bats an eye at that.

I agree. Lower levels cannot have the same standard as a varsity contest or in some cases you might not have officials if such a policy were to outlaw anyone that knows anyone or is related to anyone in a lower level game.

Peace

[jalons]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

For the record Hartzell left UNI a few years later.

And that added another 30-40 games to his schedule.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I actually knew Hartzell's wife as she was an official too and she worked games in front of me at the JUCO level on the Women's side.

Actually she's still an official.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

So you are saying that if someone thinks there is a conflict, there is a conflict? That opens up a whole lot of cans of worms if that is true.

Peace

Sure does. You and I know it's not true, but to others it can be perceived as such. I can't control what fans may think. So the end result is truth be damned, they believe what they want to.


"Everything you can imagine is real."

---Pablo Picasso---

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Sure does. You and I know it's not true, but to others it can be perceived as such. I can't control what fans may think. So the end result is truth be damned, they believe what they want to.


"Everything you can imagine is real."

---Pablo Picasso---

Fans do not set the agenda or rules to who will work or not work a game. If that was the case people who lived in the same country, knows someone from a school or just likes or does not dislike a school (according to the fans) would be excluded. This is also why the only requirement for the IHSA is to list what schools you attended and the schools in which you have family or relatives that attend or work at a particular school. And even that seems to involve spouse and children in the policy, not the 3rd or 4th cousin you might not even deal with. Or better yet not the girl you once dated in college. I guess I should not have worked in the football post season in 2 different rounds as I worked schools that were in the town I lived and I had both schools. One school won and another school lost. And yes certain people knew where I lived and it was not an issue anymore than it needed to be. And the year before I worked in the basketball regional with the only private school in my town in a regional and I worked the third round of the playoffs in football with that same school (and I could go back to baseball post season games but you get the idea). I have absolutely no direct ties to these schools other than I live in the same town. I have closer ties to other schools that are completely out of my area, but when I work games my affiliations have nothing to do with my job and I believe that is the case with the vast majority of officials as well.

Peace

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Fans do not set the agenda or rules to who will work or not work a game.

But fans are the ones who complain to those who decide who will work the games. It trickles down.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by just another ref

But fans are the ones who complain to those who decide who will work the games. It trickles down.

True, but those who make those decisions need to have some stones and make rational decisions.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

True, but those who make those decisions need to have some stones and make rational decisions.

Agree 100%, but it doesn't always happen. I could give examples.

[BillyClyde 68]

There is no way a ref can win in this situation even if he calls a perfect game

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by just another ref

But fans are the ones who complain to those who decide who will work the games. It trickles down.

Not in the places I work. Then again, there are too many games for me to worry about what one group of fans think.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by just another ref

But fans are the ones who complain to those who decide who will work the games. It trickles down.

??? 99.8% of the fans around here don't have the slightest idea who assigns games.

Shoot, I work games at my son's high school (he doesn't play) and most of the staff at the game don't even know I'm a parent of a student at their school.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

??? 99.8% of the fans around here don't have the slightest idea who assigns games.

Shoot, I work games at my son's high school (he doesn't play) and most of the staff at the game don't even know I'm a parent of a student at their school.

My daughter (9) asked me a few weeks back if I will block her high school when she gets there (scary hypothetical of the week). I told her the only way I'd block her school is if she has friends on one of the teams or if she's playing.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

??? 99.8% of the fans around here don't have the slightest idea who assigns games.

And in my area this is probably even a higher percentage.

Peace

[bigbeardedbryan]

The Catholic school in my hometown assigns its chaplain as one of the referees for each of its boys and girls varsity games. Not quite family, but still a pretty obvious conflict of interest.

[just another ref]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

??? 99.8% of the fans around here don't have the slightest idea who assigns games.

I was talking about principals, ADs, etc.