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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 05:56pm
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Jump Ball Violation to begin game

My wife saw this happen the other night as she was Shot Clock operator for the game. Start of GV game, white v. black, as ball was thrown for tip-off, either white22 or white42 (acting as center for the jump, though neither is listed as center) jumped early & a violation was called against white, so black had the ball, with the AP going to white. The timer started the clock as white touched the ball, 1 sec. ticked off. R went to table & said clock reset to 8:00.

Was the proper procedure followed in this situation?
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 06:04pm
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Originally Posted by chseagle View Post
My wife saw this happen the other night as she was Shot Clock operator for the game. Start of GV game, white v. black, as ball was thrown for tip-off, either white22 or white42 (acting as center for the jump, though neither is listed as center) jumped early & a violation was called against white, so black had the ball, with the AP going to white. The timer started the clock as white touched the ball, 1 sec. ticked off. R went to table & said clock reset to 8:00.

Was the proper procedure followed in this situation?
If the violation occurred at or before the touch, no time should have been ticked off. So yes, reset the clock to 8:00. What was the violation? Touching the ball while it was still going up?
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 06:11pm
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I wouldn't re-set the clock on this, assuming the violation was on the initial touch; but the rule seems vague to me. For evidence, see the entire discussion about whether the clock should be corrected if a player catches a throwin pass with his foot on the OOB line.

As for the rest, they did it correctly. Since the arrow had not yet been established, it will be established as soon as the thrower is handed the ball for the throw in.
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 06:15pm
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Originally Posted by representing View Post
If the violation occurred at or before the touch, no time should have been ticked off. So yes, reset the clock to 8:00. What was the violation? Touching the ball while it was still going up?
The ball hadn't reached the apex of the toss, so she touched the ball as it was going up.

When my wife was playing, she did this same exact thing.

The timer started the clock as soon as she touched the ball.
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 06:26pm
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Talking EZ solution

Quote:
Originally Posted by chseagle View Post
My wife saw this happen the other night as she was Shot Clock operator for the game. Start of GV game, white v. black, as ball was thrown for tip-off, either white22 or white42 (acting as center for the jump, though neither is listed as center) jumped early & a violation was called against white, so black had the ball, with the AP going to white. The timer started the clock as white touched the ball, 1 sec. ticked off. R went to table & said clock reset to 8:00.

Was the proper procedure followed in this situation?
She should of (sic) set off the shot clock alarm until the R came to the table and informed him of the deception by W22 or W42 masquerading as a center. She also should of (sic) told the R he needed to enforce the unsporting T for unidentified center jumper, and seatbelt the W coach, based on Rule 11 part 4 section 2(J).

Then make the R have a do-over, after shooting the T's.

She should then force the game clock operator to apologize for breaking protocol by not studiously watching for U1 to chop the clock at the tipoff. Finally, berate the game clock operator for not paying attention to pre-game table conference.

I don't have a problem with anything else beyond the few, minor suggestions, which you are welcome to ignore since I'm


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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 06:44pm
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Originally Posted by justacoach View Post
She should of (sic) set off the shot clock alarm until the R came to the table and informed him of the deception by W22 or W42 masquerading as a center. She also should of (sic) told the R he needed to enforce the unsporting T for unidentified center jumper, and seatbelt the W coach, based on Rule 11 part 4 section 2(J).

Then make the R have a do-over, after shooting the T's.

She should then force the game clock operator to apologize for breaking protocol by not studiously watching for U1 to chop the clock at the tipoff. Finally, berate the game clock operator for not paying attention to pre-game table conference.

I don't have a problem with anything else beyond the few, minor suggestions, which you are welcome to ignore since I'm


justacoach
Justacoach,

A lot of the teams around here do not have anyone listed as centers. For the home team (white), everyone takes turns playing center depending on who playing against.

Concerning the shot clock buzzer in that gym, it is barely heard when there's lots of fan noise (as is the case during all Varsity Games), so it would of been a moot point to buzz it.
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 07:03pm
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Originally Posted by chseagle View Post
Justacoach,

A lot of the teams around here do not have anyone listed as centers. For the home team (white), everyone takes turns playing center depending on who playing against.

Concerning the shot clock buzzer in that gym, it is barely heard when there's lots of fan noise (as is the case during all Varsity Games), so it would of been a moot point to buzz it.
Uh...does the word sarcasm come to mind?
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 07:10pm
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Uh...does the word sarcasm come to mind?
Someone please email him a quarter so he can buy a C-L-U-E...

Good luck wit dat..
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 07:20pm
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Someone please email him a quarter so he can buy a C-L-U-E...

Good luck wit dat..
My guess is: Colonel Mustard in the study with the candlestick LMAO.

I saw the sarcastic tone in the posting, was just doing some clarification.

BTW, according to the AD, a new shot clock buzzer (that hopefully is louder) is on order for the gym.

Until that happens, all that can be done is the shot clock operator do a verbal countdown with less than 10 sec., then when the shot clock reaches 0 have the timer buzz.
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Last edited by chseagle; Mon Jan 25, 2010 at 07:22pm.
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 11:06pm
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Originally Posted by Snaqwells View Post
I wouldn't re-set the clock on this, assuming the violation was on the initial touch; but the rule seems vague to me. For evidence, see the entire discussion about whether the clock should be corrected if a player catches a throwin pass with his foot on the OOB line.

As for the rest, they did it correctly. Since the arrow had not yet been established, it will be established as soon as the thrower is handed the ball for the throw in.
I would reset the clock in this specific case.
The reason is that the rules prohibit the player from touching the ball at this point. The prohibition is not on where the player is, but specifically for touching the ball prior to it reaching the apex of the toss. Therefore, the touch itself is not legal. To me that is the difference between this situation and the OOB plays in which a player standing on a boundary line touches the throw-in pass. In that case there is nothing wrong with touching the ball, the problem is where his feet are positioned.

The important rules are:
5-9-2 . . . If play is started or resumed by a jump, the clock shall be started
when the tossed ball is legally touched.
6-3-6 . . .The tossed ball must be touched by one or both of the jumpers after
it reaches its highest point. If the ball contacts the floor without being touched by
at least one of the jumpers, the referee shall toss it again.
6-3-7 . . .Neither jumper shall:
a. Touch the tossed ball before it reaches its highest point.

Last edited by Nevadaref; Tue Jan 26, 2010 at 12:54am.
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Old Mon Jan 25, 2010, 11:34pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chseagle View Post
The ball hadn't reached the apex of the toss, so she touched the ball as it was going up.

When my wife was playing, she did this same exact thing.

The timer started the clock as soon as she touched the ball.
Several years ago, when I was working in another city, in another state, I had the same team three games in a row. First game, they're the away team, and they steal the tip (get it on the way up). I froze and missed it, but realized it right away.

Two days later I was ready for them, and they did it again and I got it. This was in their home gym. Next game, they were away again, and they didn't do it. That game, however, had a fight in the last minute; but that's a topic for another thread.
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Old Tue Jan 26, 2010, 08:12am
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A lot of the teams around here do not have anyone listed as centers. For the home team (white), everyone takes turns playing center depending on who playing against.
Who cares?
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Old Tue Jan 26, 2010, 08:15am
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Originally Posted by Smitty View Post
Who cares?
+1 - All I want is at least five names and five legal numbers in the book.

I had a #19 last night. Private school.
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Old Tue Jan 26, 2010, 11:16am
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+1 - All I want is at least five names and five legal numbers in the book.

I had a #19 last night. Private school.
Lemme guess, masking tape?
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Old Tue Jan 26, 2010, 11:49am
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I had a bunch of illegal numbers in a MS game last week. First foul I reported on #27 I kinda hitched: "Red, twenty.... seven? (two hands), hold..." I thought about a T for a moment, and then realized that it wouldn't fly. Life went on.
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