Throw-in

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

You don't see an angle by the definition of unsporting foul?

"...noncontact technical foul which consists of unfair, unethical, dishonorable conduct or any behavior not in accordance with the spirit of fair play"

One could argue that play is not "in the spirit of fair play"....I believe a tech either way could be defended...

If we're partners and you decide to call a T on that one in close game with seconds to go.............I'm in the parking lot fully dressed with the engine running before you're administering.

I realize it's just forum discussion but in my eye it doesn't come remotely close to any criteria for an unsporting foul that you suggest.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

That's what I meant, but unfortunately not what I wrote.

Well, we both know I've done that before.

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by fullor30

If we're partners and you decide to call a T on that one in close game with seconds to go.............I'm in the parking lot fully dressed with the engine running before you're administering.

I realize it's just forum discussion but in my eye it doesn't come remotely close to any criteria for an unsporting foul that you suggest.

ok let's think about that for a second though since your right this is just a forum discussion..the situation i described is team A down 5 with 2 seconds to go. for all intents and purposes that game is over. in my scenario i tech team A, how does that do anything to swing the outcome of the game? in your game you tech team B, thereby creating a scenario where a not so close game just got close, and that call has potentially swung the outcome of the game. now we can debate the rules support for either call all day long (which we have), but my call is a hell of a lot less controversial as far as the outcome of the game goes and there is a lot less need to hit the parking lot early...i'm not saying your call would be wrong, but if team A ends up tying the game in regulation and winning in overtime, i think the likelihood of us needing a security escort out is higher in your scenario than me teching team A and team B winning by 7 instead of 5....now of course none of this is any reason to make a call or not make a call when it is the cut and dry correct call, but i think it is a little dramatic to imply that you would have to run from an unsporting T in that situation...again i just go back to "in the spirit of fair play"...can you think of another situation where baiting an opponent into a technical foul would not be a technical foul on the "baiter"?

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by CoachP

If I am up 5 (4 for that matter) with one second, my players are nowhere near the throw in.

We had 2 FTs with 6 seconds left up by 4 . I cleared the lane and had my players stand inbounds by the bench. Not for the reason of the topic, but because I have varsity girls and I've seen plenty of enough dumb things happen. Clock runs out before/if I needed to throw in.

Good move, but we both know that not all coaches are that smart....and even for those that are, we both know that players don't always do what they are told!

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

ok let's think about that for a second though since your right this is just a forum discussion..the situation i described is team A down 5 with 2 seconds to go.

Capitals, periods and paragraphs are your friend.

[slow whistle]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Capitals, periods and paragraphs are your friend.

Geez just had a flashback to 12th grade grammar. However, point taken.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

Good move, but we both know that not all coaches are that smart....and even for those that are, we both know that players don't always do what they are told!

And it's not our job to protect them if they aren't or don't.

If A1 places the ball on the floor and wipes her hands on her shorts, are you going to give her a T? How obvious does it have to be? It's too subjective, IMO, and there's no precedent for calling it this way.

The T on B1 is much easier to explain, and justify, because it's concrete. What's the coach going to say, "she tricked her into it!" Really?

If you see it coming, then hit your whistle as soon as B1 reaches across and give the warning (assuming they haven't burned that already).

[Nevadaref]

For those debating the merits of charging any technical fouls in this situation (thrower purposely places the ball on the floor OOB within the designated throw-in spot and the defender reaches across the boundary plane and grabs the ball), please consider these rules:


10-3-10 A player shall not:... Reach through the throw-in boundary-line plane and touch or dislodge the ball as in 9-2 Penalty 3.

9-2 Penalty 3.
If an opponent(s) of the thrower reaches through the throw-in boundary line plane and touches or dislodges the ball while in possession of the thrower or being passed to a teammate outside the boundary line (as in 7-5-7), a technical foul shall be charged to the offender. No warning for delay required. See 10-3-10 Penalty.

So, obviously one must consider what constitutes the ball being "in possession of the thrower" when deciding if a technical foul would be proper.

Please carry-on now.

[Adam]

Good point, NV.
D.O.G. warning and that's it. I believe that restriction doesn't end until the ball is released on the throwin pass (heading out in a sec to grab the book and check). That said, if the D.O.G. warning has already been issued to B, you've got the T.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

If you see it coming, then hit your whistle as soon as B1 reaches across and give the warning (assuming they haven't burned that already).

Can't do that. There's a specific case play that if contact is made, you can't give a warning by blowing the whistle early.

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by slow whistle

ok let's think about that for a second though since your right this is just a forum discussion..the situation i described is team A down 5 with 2 seconds to go. for all intents and purposes that game is over. in my scenario i tech team A, how does that do anything to swing the outcome of the game? in your game you tech team B, thereby creating a scenario where a not so close game just got close, and that call has potentially swung the outcome of the game. now we can debate the rules support for either call all day long (which we have), but my call is a hell of a lot less controversial as far as the outcome of the game goes and there is a lot less need to hit the parking lot early...i'm not saying your call would be wrong, but if team A ends up tying the game in regulation and winning in overtime, i think the likelihood of us needing a security escort out is higher in your scenario than me teching team A and team B winning by 7 instead of 5....now of course none of this is any reason to make a call or not make a call when it is the cut and dry correct call, but i think it is a little dramatic to imply that you would have to run from an unsporting T in that situation...again i just go back to "in the spirit of fair play"...can you think of another situation where baiting an opponent into a technical foul would not be a technical foul on the "baiter"?

Where did I post that?

I respectfully ask at what level do you officiate?

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Dribbling is ok, and I don't know of any rule against fumbling. This doesn't become a violation, IMO, until the ball bounces in bounds or A1 steps outside the designated spot.

Snaqs,

A1 attempts an inbounds pass and it hits OB before it enters inbounds and you have nothing?

That's what I was getting at and may not have worded it clearly

[Adam]

Originally Posted by fullor30

Snaqs,

A1 attempts an inbounds pass and it hits OB before it enters inbounds and you have nothing?

That's what I was getting at and may not have worded it clearly

No, I have a violation, but that's not what I have on the OP. He's not attempting to throw an inbounds pass, he's attempting to "dribble" (scare quotes for Nevada's benefit) the ball.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Can't do that. There's a specific case play that if contact is made, you can't give a warning by blowing the whistle early.

I tried to find this case play and couldn't. Guidance please?

[fullor30]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

No, I have a violation, but that's not what I have on the OP. He's not attempting to throw an inbounds pass, he's attempting to "dribble" (scare quotes for Nevada's benefit) the ball.

I was off on another tangent in a post.

Regarding OP situation, can you liken this to a free throw where A1 fumbles and ball rolls across the free throw line( after securing it from official).............and you have a violation


Wouldn't this be the same as OP, where ball is out of designated area?

Just more food for thought.