could I have fixed this?

[tcosmo]

No home book being kept. Home team Coach ok with visiting team keeping the book. Inexpierenced clock person (trouble with posession all game).
5th grade tournament. Tie game 39-39 8.9 left on clock, Blue calls time out after a red make. Time out awarded. coming out of time out ball is inbounded to red and they score 39-41, blue inbounds after make and time runs out. game over. Blue Coach protests. There are no options? right? Game over my mistake. Even the director of the tournament has no options, except to learn from the bad call and possibly put rules to mandate there be a rep at the table to help the Blue coach.

[mutantducky]

nah, once it has been inbounded and especially after a made basket then de nada. Too bad, but it does happen even at higher levels.
If you realize you made a mistake blow the whistle even if the ball is live because the coaches won't mind the ball going to the team it is supposed to BUT DO IT BEFORE A shot/BASKET!

what does this mean, I assume you are saying you gave the ball to red when it should have been blue
?"Even the director of the tournament has no options, except to learn from the bad call and possibly put rules to mandate there be a rep at the table to help the Blue coach.
Reply With Quote

[tcosmo]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

nah, once it has been inbounded and especially after a made basket then de nada. Too bad, but it does happen even at higher levels.
If you realize you made a mistake blow the whistle even if the ball is live because the coaches won't mind the ball going to the team it is supposed to BUT DO IT BEFORE A shot/BASKET!

what does this mean, I assume you are saying you gave the ball to red when it should have been blue
?"Even the director of the tournament has no options, except to learn from the bad call and possibly put rules to mandate there be a rep at the table to help the Blue coach.
Reply With Quote

Because blue coach appealed to the director and is putting much of the blame on her and i believe she made the right call. game over sorry it will not happen again or it may have been prevented if you had a book keeper on your side. therefor mandating next time that every team will keep there own book. Thanks for your reply.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

If you realize you made a mistake blow the whistle even if the ball is live because the coaches won't mind the ball going to the team it is supposed to BUT DO IT BEFORE A shot/BASKET!

Sorry but that's just plain wrong. Once the throw-in ends, you can't changed a thing. You screwed up. Learn from it and move on.

THROW-IN BY WRONG TEAM BY MISTAKE
7.5.2 SITUATION A: Team A is awarded a throw-in near the division line. The administering official by mistake, puts the ball at B1's disposal. B1 completes the throw-in and Team B subsequently scores a goal. RULING: No correction can be made for the mistake by the official.

[BillyMac]

I'm confused. How would having a representative at the table help this situation?

The officials just kicked it. We can go to camps, and clinics, and pregame, and communicate, and have good eye contact, and hold the ball on one side of our body to help us remember the direction, and remember to be live during a dead ball, but sometimes a player from the wrong team steps out of bounds, and you hand him the ball. Why? Because he's there. It happens to a few of the best of us, rarely, but it does happen. Learn from it, and hope that it never happens again.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I'm confused. How would having a representative at the table help this situation?

Question of the day, my friend.

[just another ref]

but if it's a fifth grade game, especially if it has any deviation from normal rules, (limits on pressing, etc.) especially if any of the officials are less than certified, especially if this happens with the game on the line, put the time back on the clock, and give it to the right team.

What does the book have to do with any of this?

[youngump]

Originally Posted by tcosmo

No home book being kept. Home team Coach ok with visiting team keeping the book. Inexpierenced clock person (trouble with posession all game).
5th grade tournament. Tie game 39-39 8.9 left on clock, Blue calls time out after a red make. Time out awarded. coming out of time out ball is inbounded to red and they score 39-41, blue inbounds after make and time runs out. game over. Blue Coach protests. There are no options? right? Game over my mistake. Even the director of the tournament has no options, except to learn from the bad call and possibly put rules to mandate there be a rep at the table to help the Blue coach.

Blue called timeout after Red scored to make it a tie game and they couldn't remember out of the timeout that they were supposed to have the ball?
And they think changing the rules is the solution?
________
The Legend Condominium Cosy Beach

[CMHCoachNRef]

Originally Posted by tcosmo

No home book being kept. Home team Coach ok with visiting team keeping the book. Inexpierenced clock person (trouble with posession all game).
5th grade tournament. Tie game 39-39 8.9 left on clock, Blue calls time out after a red make. Time out awarded. coming out of time out ball is inbounded to red and they score 39-41, blue inbounds after make and time runs out. game over. Blue Coach protests. There are no options? right? Game over my mistake. Even the director of the tournament has no options, except to learn from the bad call and possibly put rules to mandate there be a rep at the table to help the Blue coach.

By Rule (which becomes something sort of important for us in the officiating business), there is nothing you can do in this situation for the Blue team. Putting someone at the scorer's table will do NOTHING for the Blue team.

What the Blue coach needs to do is keep a MUCH CLOSER eye on who the officials are giving the ball to for a throw-in. I would also have a designated inbounder, with this small amount of time remaining and the score tied, you can bet that all five players would have had a role to play. That player would have known something was wrong pretty quickly!

What YOU need to do as an official is develop a technique for remembering which team will be inbounding the ball. If you are at the inbound spot/location always hold the ball in a manner in which you can determine which way the ball is to go (personally, I hold the ball in the hand nearest the basket the offensive team is attacking when I face the scorer's table. If the team can run the end line, I do the same, but I stand slightly inside the end line.). If you are an off official, you can slightly pull the pocket up in your pants or keep the hand open (similar to the ball situation above) or stand slightly to the left/right (by a few inches) of your designated position to help you remember direction. Additionally, make sure that you communicate to both teams and your partner(s) where the ball will be located for the next throw-in and WHO will be taking it as you report the time out.

You could "correct" your error as many have suggested. Most or even all of the parents, coaches and players would likely support your decision by getting it right. I have argued that this situation SHOULD be "correctable" to a point (I cannot justify correcting this one after the basket is scored), BUT it is not today. "Correcting" this error would be reasonable to just about anyone who DOESN'T KNOW THE RULES!!! So, if, after reviewing this thread you feel that you want to set the rules aside, you may have done the "fair" thing as several have pointed out. On the other hand, you would be CLEARLY setting aside a rule in doing so.

Good arguments on both sides. Unfortunately, when arguing a rules question on an officials forum, I hope you understand that we should be following the rules as they are defined. But, in the future, let's hope that the official (and the coach) are paying a bit more attention so that the kids aren't learning that kind of life lesson on their "watch."