What Not to Do/Say! - Page 2

Adam · #16 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 03:26pm

Like I said; stupid.

jdmara · #17 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 05:45pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by MOofficial

In Missouri there is. I am now looking at the sheet they hand out at our annual meeting and it reads as follows:

The Board of Directors adopted the following Policy, March, 1997, to address protest.....

1. Within the procedures established...
2. If the coach still believes there has been a misapplication of a rule by a contest official, the coach shall then file a formal verbal protest with the game official who will then notify the opposing coach immediately of the protest.
3. Followign the notification of the protest, the coach shall be allowed approximately ten minutes to use his/her NF rules book. If the head coach does not have personal copies of teh above mentioned materials at teh game site or the specific rule reference or case book plays cannot be located within the maximum allowable ten minutes, the protest shall automatically be disallowed adn teh game shall continue POI.
4. All protest shall be resolved at the contest site before any further game action occurs.
5......
6. The MSHSAA Board of Directors/ and or Staff shall not review contest protests

B. Process
1.Once the head coach has filed a formal verbal protest with teh game officials, they shall notify the opposing head coach of the protest adn the playing field, court, mat, etc. shall be cleared of all participants and they shall report to their respective team bench areas.
2. The head coach shall then be allowed approx. ten minutes to locate specific rules........The game officials shall also confer among themselves durign the period to address teh claim of the coach as to the potential rule missapplication
3. If the head coach is able to produce rule evidence from teh above mentioned sources to support the claim of a missapplication of a game rule, the officials shall correct the error as provided in the contest rules and the contest shall proceed from the POI. If the head coach cannot produce the evidence , the protest shall be disallowed and the contest shall continue from the POI.

With all that being said. I've never seen it happen either in Basketball nor Softball.

I'm simply shocked...Question for you though MO, what is the correctable time frame in which a rule can be corrected by protest?

Failure to award a merited free throw or Awarding an unmerited free throw falls under 2-10. So does the protest has to occur before the provisions provided in 2-10?

-Josh

BillyMac · #18 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 06:42pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

I'm glad you said the game was 2 hours up the freeway, and not down the freeway.

We drive on the parkway, and park in the driveway. Why?

If the best part of a city is uptown, what if the best part of a particular city is south of midtown? Uptown downtown?

If Billy Joel married Petula Clark ... Never mind.

CMHCoachNRef · #19 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 10:14pm

OHBBRef,
You stated, " I can guarantee that if a coach pulls out a book and says anything about something being do(ne) wrong during a game that is the an automatic E-ticket."

To each his own. If I get a call completely wrong -- by rule not by judgment -- and a coach gets the book out and confirms it.....Sorry, I am going to eat my crow with the feathers. I am NOT going to punish the coach's team -- AGAIN (typically, the reason the coach looks in the first place is because I made a mistake against his team) -- for my mistake.

We can all make mistakes. Sometimes, we have to be man enough to admit it. Just my humble opinion.

refnrev · #20 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 10:29pm

[QUOTE=MOofficial;565811]In Missouri there is.

Dang, no wonder they call it the "show me state!"

LeeBallanfant · #21 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 10:30pm

Thats nice, a Coach can take a 10 minute timeout, no penalty. If I was coach and wanted 10 minutes, I would find some rule to question.

shishstripes · #22 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 10:45pm

Rocky, those weren't Lewis County officials were they?

Adam · #23 (**permalink**) Wed Jan 07, 2009, 11:14pm

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

We can all make mistakes. Sometimes, we have to be man enough to admit it. Just my humble opinion.

OH and I have had our disagreements, but this isn't one of them. It has nothing to do with eating crow or being man enough to admit your mistake.

For better or worse, the game goes better when the official has final authority. It goes smoother, it goes faster, and it's just better.

"Coach, I'll be happy to discuss it another time, but you'll need to put the book away for the night."

rockyroad · #24 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 12:24am

Quote:

Originally Posted by shishstripes

Rocky, those weren't Lewis County officials were they?

Unfortunately, they were...

You probably had one of them when you were at Elma!

Texas Aggie · #25 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 12:26am

The coach could have gone to the table for a correctable error. He needs to know how to do that.

CMHCoachNRef · #26 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 07:45am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

OH and I have had our disagreements, but this isn't one of them. It has nothing to do with eating crow or being man enough to admit your mistake.

For better or worse, the game goes better when the official has final authority. It goes smoother, it goes faster, and it's just better.

"Coach, I'll be happy to discuss it another time, but you'll need to put the book away for the night."

First of all, I am impressed that the coach has the rule book. Secondly, I have no problem with the official having the final authority, but the part that makes the game go "smoother", "faster" and "just better" is when the official actually KNOWS the rules. Thirdly, can you state the rule or case that REQUIRES the coach to put the rule book away?

I have coached basketball for about as long as some of the oldest dinosaurs have been reffing. I got my referee license years and years ago because several officials felt that I was one of the few coaches who actually knew nearly all of the rules. I can tell you that I never expect a referee to know every single nuance of every rule and case (there would be no reason for this forum if we all did). At the same time, if we are wrong, we are wrong.

CMHCoachNRef · #27 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 07:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by Texas Aggie

The coach could have gone to the table for a correctable error. He needs to know how to do that.

Unfortunately, in this case, the correctable error procedure would not have helped this coach. This crew of officials did not believe that an error had been made -- in fact were quite adamant that they had gotten it right. Therefore, with no "error" there could be no "correction" in their minds.

OHBBREF · #28 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 08:25am

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

To each his own. If I get a call completely wrong -- by rule not by judgment -- and a coach gets the book out and confirms it.....Sorry, I am going to eat my crow with the feathers. I am NOT going to punish the coach's team -- AGAIN (typically, the reason the coach looks in the first place is because I made a mistake against his team) -- for my mistake.

If a coach calls me over in a calm manner and says Ref your enforcement/interpretation is wrong, we can have a short discussion about it. If he references something from the book (without getting it out), - I'll listen and I will discuss it with my partners and if we agree he is right we will change it.
However, if the book comes out and he wants us to look in it - it is trying to influence an officals decison, period, and also showing up the officials, and they need to look at that section of the book also.

A couple of years ago I was the R on a game and the U2 (rookie) made a call and the coach pulled out a book, and started to try to show my partner where he was wrong about a call.
After about 30 seconds I went over removed my partner from the conversation by asking him what the issue was, I then asked the coach what the issue was - the coach told me and then went back into the book.
I told the coach that no mater what he found in that book he needs to look up bench technical section about trying to influence an officials decision - while he was waiting for the game to end from the locker room, - he now has 30 seconds to leave the gym. By the way the coach was wrong.

The administration appealed to the state regarding the ejection, in the meeting the state said clearly the coach was wrong in the manner he went about doing it, and the ejection was proper.

Adam · #29 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 08:40am

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

First of all, I am impressed that the coach has the rule book. Secondly, I have no problem with the official having the final authority, but the part that makes the game go "smoother", "faster" and "just better" is when the official actually KNOWS the rules. Thirdly, can you state the rule or case that REQUIRES the coach to put the rule book away?

The rule that says the coach cannot attempt to influence a call.

rockyroad · #30 (**permalink**) Thu Jan 08, 2009, 10:15am

Quote:

Originally Posted by CMHCoachNRef

Unfortunately, in this case, the correctable error procedure would not have helped this coach. This crew of officials did not believe that an error had been made -- in fact were quite adamant that they had gotten it right. Therefore, with no "error" there could be no "correction" in their minds.

Correct...the coach calmly asked the question and was told he needed to sit down and be quiet. So how in the world would going to the table help fix the mistakes?