The officials (the referees in striped shirts) did not ask the table for help. The officials talked amongst each other and made a decision. And it does not appear that there is much disagreement amongst the official (in the striped shirts and one the floor) in any way.

Here is another thing I saw on another video. It might be possible that the officials did not feel the clock was started properly. So this is not just an issue of whether the shot got off in time, but if the time ran off the clock at the right time as well.

Here is that video I am referring to.

Another angle and uncut video from the shot to the discussion to the decision by the officials

Peace

Out Of The Sky Into The Book ...
 

I agree. The officials did not approach the table crew for help, and thus, in this specific case, this rule did not kick in.

I only referred to this rule to clear up, for rookie officials, coaches, and fans, who may view this Forum, your earlier post: "Where is the rules reference to back that up? Because there is nothing in any rule I have seen that says you can count a basket just because you are not sure. You pulled that out of the sky. That is why you have yet to show the reference yet."

If your "you" is only referring to officials, you are 100% correct, there is no rules reference. However, if there is such a rule reference if "you" refers to the table crew: Rule 2-13. So socalreff didn't pull the rule out of the sky, he pulled it out of the NFHS rule book, however, he confused the officials with the table crew.

well people could keep arguing this for a long time and I'm sure they will back where the game took place. But here is too a great rematch whenever they have it. it's pandemonium baby. wow I spelled pandemonium right on the first try. what great speling. :D

Billy, he pulled it out of the sky because not only did the officials not disagree, that is not even relevant to the case we are talking about. And 2-13 is about timers, substitutes and equipment, which neither is at issue in this play. And 2-13 talks about the equipment failing and that also did not take place in this situation in any way.

I guess if a Martian came out of the sky and shot the calling official with a laser, then we might institute Rule 2-3, but that did not take place either. It is one thing to claim something took place and reference a rule, but that is not what took place at all. And that rules reference (which he has yet to give) had nothing to do with the table officials disagreeing. The table officials were not involved at all.

Peace

My first impression was that the shot was released in time.

After watching a couple of times, I did have some doubts though. Watching the video again with some stopping at key points, and with the YouTube video, I think it is clear that the shot should have counted, and therefore Spartanburg should have won.

If this event teaches anything - it is that you do need 3 officials, and that video replay is needed: high definition video replay, with frame by frame analysis.

Edit: another angle, shows even more conclusively that the shot is good. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01xPmkNsvwU

"Yabba-Dabba-Doo!"
 

Book Citing
 

It was 68 seconds from the time the ball went in until the referee called it no good. Are you telling me that it would take them that long if they all agreed?
And if they weren't sure, why not ask the timer?

A.R. 14. In a game with no official courtside television monitor, the red light
or LED lights that signal the end of the last period cannot be seen nor
can the game-clock horn be heard. The officials disagree whether the
ball was in flight during a try for field goal or whether a foul occurred
before time expired.
RULING: The final decision shall be made by the referee. The official timer
shall indicate if the ball was in flight before the red light or LED lights signal
was activated or before the game-clock horn sounded only when requested
to do so by the referee. The referee shall use his or her best judgment; but
when the evidence for counting or not counting the goal or foul is equal, the
referee shall rule that the goal counts and that the foul shall be charged. In
a game with an official courtside television monitor and a game clock with
a 10th-of-a second display, the status of the try for goal and the committed
foul shall be ascertained with the use of the courtside monitor.
(Rule 2-10.15.c)

Go back and read rule 2-13, Billy. Specifically read the part right at the front that states <b>"If the timer's signal FAILS to sound or is NOT heard....."</b> In the situation being discussed, the timer's signal DID sound and WAS heard. That's why 2-13 isn't applicable in any way and is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

Again, 2-13 is only applicable and relevant if the horn didn't sound or wasn't heard. In the situation being discussed, the horn DID sound and WAS heard. That's why socalreff's rule reference wasn't and isn't germane to this discussion in any way.

They didn't ask the timer because they discussed it amongst themselves and mutually concluded that the goal didn't count. Iow, they were <b>sure</b>.

Disregarding the fact that you're citing an NCAA rule to try and back up your argument in a situation that happened under NFHS rules, why are you trying to apply a rule that is ONLY relevant in situations where officials <b>disagree</b>?:confused:

In the situation being discussed, the officials did NOT disagree. No rules reference cited by yourself to date has had any relevancy at all to this discussion.

Violation White A1
9-1-9
Green gets another FT.
:p

Correct ...
 

100% correct. At least your final sentence is well worded. socalref's wasn't germane to this specific situation. But he didn't pull the rule out of the sky, he pulled it out of the wrong section of the rule book, like using Rule 1-6 Free Throw Line to explain a false double foul. Please reread my earlier posts in this thread. As you may already know about me, I like to expand the limits of original posts, to make sure rookie officials fully understand some rules and interpretations. Again, you're right, in this specific case, but there is a rule that says if "someone" disagrees, the basket counts. The "someone" must be the table crew, not an official. socaref confused this important difference. I wanted to make sure that others, especially rookie officials, didn't as well.

"The officials on the court I am sure had a different take on the play and what they saw on a video."

Jeff........ typo? Unless you meant when they took a peek later.

http://tinyurl.com/35oere

Frame 10

Wow. Just wow. That's about as close as possible. So, somewhere in the 1/30th of a second between the ball being still in his hand and the ball being away from his hand, the light comes on. Add in that they believe the horn sounds after the light is visible, and it's a very strange play.

Thanks for the link.