Making a call in your partners area.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Raida357

My regular partner recently worked a F/JV doubleheader with a different official. The conference assignor and an evaluator were present to rate the Varsity crew, but they also watched the JV game. The only major issue the evaluator had was that my partner made a foul call on a play in the other officials area of responsibility. Here is the play:

My partner was trail on a fast break by Team A, just as A1 jumped for a lay-up attempt, B1 grabbed his jersey from behind. The other official had no angle and was completely blocked out by A1. My partner made the call. Neither coach had an issue with the call or the fact that my partner made it.

After the game, the evaluator said that an official should never make a call outside their area of responsibility. Do the veteran officials agree? I understand the importance of watching the play in your area and not tracking the ball, but there are some situations where you see something obvious outside your area. Don't we have an obligation to call a foul/violation if we see it? Just wondering what others think.

This is not a situation of the T going out of his area to make a call. The T is supposed to get this call every time. The jersey grab from behind is a natural for the T to call. The assignor needs to smacked upside the head with an officials mechanics manual. If I was the evaluator, I would be upset if the T did NOT make this call.

MTD, Sr.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

This is not a situation of the T going out of his area to make a call. The T is supposed to get this call every time. The jersey grab from behind is a natural for the T to call. The assignor needs to smacked upside the head with an officials mechanics manual. If I was the evaluator, I would be upset if the T did NOT make this call.

MTD, Sr.

Exactly. Those evaluators that think a jersey grab on a fast break is better uncalled than called by someone he thinks is "out of his area" is not suited for evaluating officials.

There's a reason the T/C hustles back on a fast break, after all.

[rainmaker]

Your evaluator and/or assignor are ALWAYS right when you're talking to them. "Yes, I see your point. Okay, uh-huh... right.... thank you."

BUT you should also ALWAYS pre-game how you and your partner are going to work together to pick up these kinds of situations. Some partners are the "Stay out of my area. Period" types. Then you stay out of their area. You get in, get done, get out. Most partners want to work together to get the call right. A gotta-get call that your partner is screened on, well, you call it. Even when you know your evaluator is watching and will disapprove. Then if the eval says, "But I talked to you about that two weeks ago." you say, "Yea, I know. I'll keep working on it. Thanks."

And then you keep pre-gaming with partners. Eventually, the eval will talk to you both together and the partner will say, "I was really glad he caught that. I was screened out."

[Terrapins Fan]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

This is not a situation of the T going out of his area to make a call. The T is supposed to get this call every time. The jersey grab from behind is a natural for the T to call. The assignor needs to smacked upside the head with an officials mechanics manual. If I was the evaluator, I would be upset if the T did NOT make this call.

MTD, Sr.

Good answer Mark.

I always tell my partners, If you see something that I miss, mostly walks in the lane when I am looking at hands for fouls, call it. I'd rather get it right than miss it.

[VTOfficial]

In our area we don't encourage calling out of our PCA's, but if it's needed we try to keep three things in mind before making a call:

1. Be late -- Give your partner a chance to see the play through and make the call. It is definitely better to be late on a call than to not make the right call.
2. Be right -- Definitely make sure the call you are going to make outside your PCA is the right call and not something that is borderline.
3. Be needed -- If your partner got screened out of the play then obviously he could miss something that your angle will pick up.

There are only two or three of us on the floor to catch everything so sometimes we need help from our partners to help us out when we have bad angles or are looking at a different area of the floor.

I would disagree with the evaluator and his comment...sometimes it is necessary.

[SMEngmann]

Coverage areas are just that, areas, not absolute, territorial lines on the floor. The overriding goal, in my opinion, is team officiating, as in getting plays right as a team and checking ego at the door. Team officiating requires all 3 (2) officials working for angles to cover the competitive matchups and to assist each other. Far too many calls get missed because the official with the best angle doesn't want to step on the toes of the other guys. Using the lines on the floor theory we lose coverage on plays like curls and diagonal cuts where the primary official based on the lines does not have the best angle on the play and can't see the contact.

In my pregames, especially in 2 man games, we review the basic coverage, but I also mention that our goal is to referee where our partner(s) cannot, regardless of what the lines on the floor say to do. Now that being said, the further away, the less believable the call, so the more obvious the play has to be. The better your positioning, the easier it is to officiate where your partner cannot, which includes on the ball and off. Again, I'm not advocating ball-watching, just positioning in a place where you can cover where your partner can't.

[ca_rumperee]

... in terms of PCA. 2 man mechanics.

I am trail.
Ball is in corner in front of lead. I am closing down watching all action outside the lead's corner, predominantly in the key.

Player in corner drives to the key, or passes to post player who turns into the key. In both instances I'm not really talking about along the endline, but rather towards the area between ft line and basket. Play is coming at me, and I know my partner will often have a view of nothing but player's backsides.
If I have a foul there, I call it. That's just been my approach this year. Haven't really had any conversation with anyone about it.

Am I poaching, or is the key 'mine' in the above scenario?

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by ca_rumperee

... in terms of PCA. 2 man mechanics.

I am trail.
Ball is in corner in front of lead. I am closing down watching all action outside the lead's corner, predominantly in the key.

Player in corner drives to the key, or passes to post player who turns into the key. In both instances I'm not really talking about along the endline, but rather towards the area between ft line and basket. Play is coming at me, and I know my partner will often have a view of nothing but player's backsides.
If I have a foul there, I call it. That's just been my approach this year. Haven't really had any conversation with anyone about it.

Am I poaching, or is the key 'mine' in the above scenario?

I would say what you are saying has merit in both 2 and 3 man games. It sounds like the play is curling away from the lead meaning the lead will probably have to guess.

Also, God help you if you are still doing 2 man. A 2 man game requires many rules of thumb followed in a 3 man game be broken.

[ma_ref]

I'm pretty sure I'm probably not saying anything that hasn't been posted already but I figured I'd chime in with my .02 cents.

When I work with somebody I haven't worked with before, I tell them that I don't have the mentality of "I call my area, you call yours" like a lot of the old-school refs. I tell them that if they see something, then they should call it. That being said, I will call a foul in my partner's primary only if both of the following 2 conditions are met:

1. I see the foul. If I don't see it clearly, then I've got nothing.
2. I'm 110% sure my partner didn't see it. Generally this happens when my partner is the L, and there's action in the lane. The player with the ball usually does a pivot, fade away jumper, and usually gets hit on the way up with the ball. My partner will be screened to the contact, and there's just no possible way he could've seen the contact. During a subsequent time-out or time between quarters, I'll tell them what I saw. If I feel that my partner had a decent view of the play, but passed on it for whatever reason, then I've got nothing.

To the OP, I'd recommend bringing this up at 1 of your early board meetings next season, or maybe mention it to your interpreter. You don't necessarily have to mention what league you worked, or who the evaluator was, but the comments from the evaluator would be a bad habit to start for the newer officials. I'm not advocating always calling out of your primary, but there are certainly times where you should.

Quick little related play from my early days of officiating. It was maybe my 1st or 2nd season working a local youth league. Probably 5th or 6th grade boys game. I'm T jogging alongside A1 with the ball bringing it up the court. A1 gets over half-court and B1 and B2 leap forward and have A1 trapped in the corner of the front court just over the half-court line. A1 picks up his dribble and is pivoting right in front of me trying to find somebody to pass to, and I've got my eyes going back and forth between his feet, the half-court line, and the defenders hands going for the ball. All are doing good - A1 not travelling and has no half foot on half court line; B1+2 have no illegal contact on A1. All of a sudden I hear, "Tweet"...and my partner made an over-and-back call from the end-line under the basket. Yikes. Honest to goodness true story...

[tomegun]

Originally Posted by VTOfficial

In our area we don't encourage calling out of our PCA's, but if it's needed we try to keep three things in mind before making a call:

1. Be late -- Give your partner a chance to see the play through and make the call. It is definitely better to be late on a call than to not make the right call.
2. Be right -- Definitely make sure the call you are going to make outside your PCA is the right call and not something that is borderline.
3. Be needed -- If your partner got screened out of the play then obviously he could miss something that your angle will pick up.

There are only two or three of us on the floor to catch everything so sometimes we need help from our partners to help us out when we have bad angles or are looking at a different area of the floor.

I would disagree with the evaluator and his comment...sometimes it is necessary.

You are new or at least have only posted twice, but this is a quality post. Contrary to what some may think, I know situations happen in a game where we may have to "extend" our coverage area. Your three points are spot on, IMO, when deciding why to do such. If those three criteria are met I have no problem with a call in my area. However, I'm not dumb enough to buy the whole "get the call right" mantra - it is asking for a license to ball watch. A lot of people will be constantly seeking opportunities to "get the call right." Mysteriously those opportunities are normally looked for on the ball. Funny how that happens.

If someone needs that much help, help them by teaching them how to officiate with angles in their primary.

[TheOracle]

Originally Posted by Raida357

After the game, the evaluator said that an official should never make a call outside their area of responsibility. Do the veteran officials agree? I understand the importance of watching the play in your area and not tracking the ball, but there are some situations where you see something obvious outside your area. Don't we have an obligation to call a foul/violation if we see it? Just wondering what others think.

"Boundaries" for primary areas, as defined by lines on a sheet of paper, are guidelines. There are times when you do not get the right angle from yuor primary. If you have the best angle on a play, and it has to be called, you make the call, period. That is what is best for the game; our egos are not.

If the primary has the best angle, let him live with it unless it is an "Oh my God" foul, where the crew credibility would be at stake.