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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:16am
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Is this a foul to you?

A1 is dribbling from the division line in his front court on an angle toward the left side of the paint. He is being guarded by B1 who is matching him step for step. There is very minor foot to foot contact, A1 loses his balance and goes down, the ball rolls out of bounds. I decline to call a foul because I couldn't determine that either player did anything out of the way to cause the contact and rule it incidental. A1's coach questions the play and I ask him if B1 was the player to go down would he expect me to call it on his player. That caused him to stop and ponder the answer while I quickly put the ball back into play.

I know it is usually a foul on the defense when the offense gets tripped up, but in this case, do you think it should have been called.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:20am
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Depends entirely on the judgement of the person officiating that particular play.

The question I ask myself is this: Did B1 trip A1 or did A1 step on B1's foot?
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:23am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef
Depends entirely on the judgement of the person officiating that particular play.

The question I ask myself is this: Did B1 trip A1 or did A1 step on B1's foot?
That's reasonable.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:27am
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When B1 was matching "step for step" was he in front of/sliding obliquely with A1, or was he simply running beside him? I'm trying to picture the play as best I can.

BadNews's question is a really good one.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:29am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef
Depends entirely on the judgement of the person officiating that particular play.

The question I ask myself is this: Did B1 trip A1 or did A1 step on B1's foot?

Thats the answer I hoped I was going to get.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:31am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdw3018
When B1 was matching "step for step" was he in front of/sliding obliquely with A1, or was he simply running beside him? I'm trying to picture the play as best I can.

BadNews's question is a really good one.
Sliding obliquely. Hard to say it was a trip, just a tangle up.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:33am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ranjo
Sliding obliquely. Hard to say it was a trip, just a tangle up.
Makes it a lot more likely in my mind that this was not a foul.

In the end, definitely have to see it, but every time there is contact with a dribbler's feet is not a foul, for sure!
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:36am
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Exclamation

Quote:
Originally Posted by ranjo
Thats the answer I hoped I was going to get.
If A1 steps on B1's extended foot, it may still be a trip.
The answer to the question is not clear cut, but, perhaps, more of a starting point.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:39am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadNewsRef
Depends entirely on the judgement of the person officiating that particular play.

The question I ask myself is this: Did B1 trip A1 or did A1 step on B1's foot?
I agree. Definately need to see the whole thing and make sure that the defender didnt cause the trip. Often, the ball handler will trip over their own feet.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:41am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mick
If A1 steps on B1's extended foot, it may still be a trip.
The answer to the question is not clear cut, but, perhaps, more of a starting point.
The fact that I didn't observe an extended foot is the reason I let it go.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:43am
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Your call, your judgement, that MHO!!!!!
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 11:47am
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I have heard several officials make the following statement...

Players usually dont fall down by themselves

That being said there is some incidental contact that we let go, but if who tripped up who?

Gotta watch the whole play....

Rarely do two players running in exactlly parallel lines, running stride for stride, ever trip each other up... did somone move into the other's path?

You said the A was running towards an angle to wards the left side of the paint. Most defendes dont want defend stride for stride here, the are going to try and do something to divert path???

As said in previous post, the questions are a mere starting... but I'd say if a player gets tangled up most of the time I have a foul just because most players are coordinated enough not to trip on their own feet... obviously the lower in skill you go this changes.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 01:29pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ranjo
A1 is dribbling from the division line in his front court on an angle toward the left side of the paint. He is being guarded by B1 who is matching him step for step. There is very minor foot to foot contact, A1 loses his balance and goes down, the ball rolls out of bounds. I decline to call a foul because I couldn't determine that either player did anything out of the way to cause the contact and rule it incidental. A1's coach questions the play and I ask him if B1 was the player to go down would he expect me to call it on his player. That caused him to stop and ponder the answer while I quickly put the ball back into play.

I know it is usually a foul on the defense when the offense gets tripped up, but in this case, do you think it should have been called.
probably no foul
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 07:03pm
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Difference ???

"There's a difference between being tripped, and tripping."

I probably say this line to a coach once, or twice, each season.

Wait a minute. I don't think that I've ever seen this statement on the Forum before.

"There's a difference between being tripped, and tripping." 2008 BillyMac

Any reproduction, or other use of this statement, without the express written consent of BillyMac is prohibited.
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Old Fri Feb 29, 2008, 10:11pm
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I've used that same statement when explaing this scenario BillyMac, but the copyright is all yours.
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