Why do High School officials dislike College officials so much?

[Mwanr1]

I completely agree with Jurassic that doing JC ball is not for the money. And in every case, every official is different... You really can't generalize.

From one HS association, I have refs who think I don't deserve to be there because I'm relatively young to officiating (experience wise). From another association, I have refs who think highly of me now because I now work at the JUCO level.

I want to share one of my experiences with you guys....

I did a JC game this season that took me about 8+ hours and got paid only $115. Take $35 dollars our of the $115 for gas because round trip from work to gym and back home is about 260 miles. I make about $120 dollars doing two local varsity games that'll take me 3 hour at most and 5 minute of travel time.

So tip off is 6pm on a Friday night. Our JC association requires us to get there at least 1 hour before tip off. I assumed the drive will take about 2 hours without traffic. On Friday afternoon, you never know what the roads will be like. I left work at about 2:00 pm to give myself ample of time for travel. The drive took just about 3 hours. I got there right around 5:00. Game ended at about 7:45pm. After our post-game talk and shower, I left the gym at about 8:30PM. Got home at 10:15ish

The gym had about 30 fans and that was it. It was cold and empty. But JC college games will always take precedence over any hs games - despite of an 8+ hour trip.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mwanr1

I completely agree with Jurassic that doing JC ball is not for the money. And in every case, every official is different... You really can't generalize.

From one HS association, I have refs who think I don't deserve to be there because I'm relatively young to officiating (experience wise). From another association, I have refs who think highly of me now because I now work at the JUCO level.

I want to share one of my experiences with you guys....

I did a JC game this season that took me about 8+ hours and got paid only $115. Take $35 dollars our of the $115 for gas because round trip from work to gym and back home is about 260 miles. I make about $120 dollars doing two local varsity games that'll take me 3 hour at most and 5 minute of travel time.

So tip off is 6pm on a Friday night. Our JC association requires us to get there at least 1 hour before tip off. I assumed the drive will take about 2 hours without traffic. On Friday afternoon, you never know what the roads will be like. I left work at about 2:00 pm to give myself ample of time for travel. The drive took just about 3 hours. I got there right around 5:00. Game ended at about 7:45pm. After our post-game talk and shower, I left the gym at about 8:30PM. Got home at 10:15ish

The gym had about 30 fans and that was it. It was cold and empty. But JC college games will always take precedence over any hs games - despite of an 8+ hour trip.

Maybe for you, but not for me. I'll work the HS rivalry game every day of the week and I'll be home 2 hours before you. Last night was an exception for me (traveling alone for over 100 miles). The college guys do it all the time and I'm not interested.

My game check tonight was $100 and I worked a 7:30PM game that ended at 8:42PM and we were showered and in the car before 9PM. In the bar before 9:40PM. Driving 8 hours? No thanks.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Maybe for you, but not for me. I'll work the HS rivalry game every day of the week and I'll be home 2 hours before you. Last night was an exception for me (traveling alone for over 100 miles). The college guys do it all the time and I'm not interested.

My game check tonight was $100 and I worked a 7:30PM game that ended at 8:42PM and we were showered and in the car before 9PM. In the bar before 9:40PM. Driving 8 hours? No thanks.

That depends on where you live. Not everyone travels that far or has to. You work in certain areas around here and you hardly have an hour drive. And if it is an hour drive it is not because of mileage.

And the last thing I am ever going to do is be in the bar after most games.

This is all about person preference and what you enjoy and why you officiate. I can tell you I do not do this for the money and could care less what I make when I officiate any game. If money was the gauge of my officiating I would not travel very far for the high school games I work.

I will say this, most college officials are better trained and better officials because they learn things that many HS officials do not get exposed to. That is not a basketball thing that is a sports officiating thing. There are things I mostly do not have to worry about when I have a college official working with me in any sport. True college officials usually attend more camps and more training before they ever step onto any floor or field. High School Officials tend to be very technical. High School Officials also tend to worry about exactly what the book says when it comes to mechanics and rules and do not think outside the box or cannot adjust to a newer concept. Officiating changes every year and if the book does not change I get into more debates about what that book says rather than what it takes to officiate the game we have in front of us.

And this is just my opinion. This would not apply to everyone.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

T
I will say this, most college officials are better trained and better officials because they learn things that many HS officials do not get exposed to. That is not a basketball thing that is a sports officiating thing. There are things I mostly do not have to worry about when I have a college official working with me in any sport. True college officials usually attend more camps and more training before they ever step onto any floor or field. High School Officials tend to be very technical. High School Officials also tend to worry about exactly what the book says when it comes to mechanics and rules and do not think outside the box or cannot adjust to a newer concept.

Completely disagree. Every official is different, and you have to judge each individual official separately. You can't generalize and say "college officials are this" or "high school officials are that". There's just too many exceptions to the rule if you try to do something like that. I've seen many high school officials that fit into your generalization of college officials above, and I've also seen many college officials that don't come close to fitting your college criteria. The same goes for the "technical" and "unable to think outside the box" statements that you made about high school officials.

And that's why the opening post of this thread was just complete doo-doo from the git-go imo. The statement made in the OP was inherently wrong. It's impossible to substantiate or prove- one way or another. You can say that Jeff Rutledge is this and Jurassic Referee is that, but you can't say that anybody else is exactly like Jeff Rutledge or Jurassic Referee(which is probably a boon to mankind in itself ).

Jmo.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Completely disagree. Every official is different, and you have to judge each individual official separately. You can't generalize and say "college officials are this" or "high school officials are that". There's just too many exceptions to the rule if you try to do something like that. I've seen many high school officials that fit into your generalization of college officials above, and I've also seen many college officials that don't come close to fitting your college criteria. The same goes for the "technical" and "unable to think outside the box" statements that you made about high school officials.

The nature of is discussion is a very general on at its core. And I cannot talk about every official that I have ever worked with and every official you have worked with. But just like a political race, there are some things I can reasonably say about the Democrats vs. the Republicans. Of course there are exceptions to every characterization, but there are some things you can generalize that are accurate about each party. This comparison is no different. I am also speaking from my personal experiences and what I have seen. And college officials that I have worked with hardly ever are as ridged or unaware of many different concepts and tend to be more flexible. And I can tell by officials that have college experience by the way certain individuals talk on this site. And usually it is confirmed at a later date.

Of course officials are individuals, but most officials that work any college or try to work college have usually attended more camps and trainings.

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

And that's why the opening post of this thread was just complete doo-doo from the git-go imo. The statement made in the OP was inherently wrong. It's impossible to substantiate or prove- one way or another. You can say that Jeff Rutledge is this and Jurassic Referee is that, but you can't say that anybody else is exactly like Jeff Rutledge or Jurassic Referee(which is probably a boon to mankind in itself ).

Jmo.

The question is a fair one and often discussed outside of this board. And I hear all the time about a rift between people that work college ball and those who only work high school when I talk to officials at a social or at a meeting. And there are college officials that act like they know more than high school officials and vise versa. Usually it involves post season assignments that many perceive the college officials are unfairly taking high school post season games. In my state the only requirement is to work 10 varsity games at each level (Girl's, Boy's, Class 1A-2A and Class 3A-4A). And you always hear these stories that some guy only worked 2 high school varsity games and some guy that had 60 varsity games is passed over. I have found that claim is usually not true and often exaggerated. Even people in my area that work a lot of college ball usually work a lot of high school as well. This is mainly because they would not work very much without the high school games. And unless you are a big time college officials, chances are working 10 college games is the most you will get. And that is a little much for many guys or gals I have come in contact with.

Peace

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

That depends on where you live. Not everyone travels that far or has to. You work in certain areas around here and you hardly have an hour drive. And if it is an hour drive it is not because of mileage.

And the last thing I am ever going to do is be in the bar after most games.

This is all about person preference and what you enjoy and why you officiate. I can tell you I do not do this for the money and could care less what I make when I officiate any game. If money was the gauge of my officiating I would not travel very far for the high school games I work.

I will say this, most college officials are better trained and better officials because they learn things that many HS officials do not get exposed to. That is not a basketball thing that is a sports officiating thing. There are things I mostly do not have to worry about when I have a college official working with me in any sport. True college officials usually attend more camps and more training before they ever step onto any floor or field. High School Officials tend to be very technical. High School Officials also tend to worry about exactly what the book says when it comes to mechanics and rules and do not think outside the box or cannot adjust to a newer concept. Officiating changes every year and if the book does not change I get into more debates about what that book says rather than what it takes to officiate the game we have in front of us.

And this is just my opinion. This would not apply to everyone.

Peace

I intend to agree with you JRutledge. Working both h.s. and college, I agree before I I got hired I was a very technical h.s. official. By the book, mechanics, black and white on the rules. When I got hired i started to pull away. Not saying we are no it all's, but some of us at the college level have a little more info than h.s. guys. Being a rule know it all can get you in trouble if you don't how and when to apply the rule. Preventive officiating in h.s. game can save the game when it comes time to be technical.

[TRef21]

Originally Posted by Mwanr1

I completely agree with Jurassic that doing JC ball is not for the money. And in every case, every official is different... You really can't generalize.

From one HS association, I have refs who think I don't deserve to be there because I'm relatively young to officiating (experience wise). From another association, I have refs who think highly of me now because I now work at the JUCO level.

I want to share one of my experiences with you guys....

I did a JC game this season that took me about 8+ hours and got paid only $115. Take $35 dollars our of the $115 for gas because round trip from work to gym and back home is about 260 miles. I make about $120 dollars doing two local varsity games that'll take me 3 hour at most and 5 minute of travel time.

So tip off is 6pm on a Friday night. Our JC association requires us to get there at least 1 hour before tip off. I assumed the drive will take about 2 hours without traffic. On Friday afternoon, you never know what the roads will be like. I left work at about 2:00 pm to give myself ample of time for travel. The drive took just about 3 hours. I got there right around 5:00. Game ended at about 7:45pm. After our post-game talk and shower, I left the gym at about 8:30PM. Got home at 10:15ish

The gym had about 30 fans and that was it. It was cold and empty. But JC college games will always take precedence over any hs games - despite of an 8+ hour trip.

Nice Post. I'm too in the same boat as you. ON my 3rd season of D3 and JC. Some hate you others still like you in the association. Our age is one thing because were young and the other is we have been given the opportunity some others who are older than us have tried hard to get to, but didnt. I'm the same way Marco. You know I will drive anywhere to work a college game and give back the h.s. game. Our assignor doesnt mind. He always reminds us for those who work College and need to give back an h.s. game he doesnt have a problem as long as we give him time in advance. Damn Marco 260 miles!!! I went 320 last year!!! LOL!!!