Officials as players

[justacoach]

Originally Posted by ChrisSportsFan

I do not advise them asking about a judgment call. However, I have no problem with them telling me something like: "could you watch their screens? I'm not sure they are staying set" or "my post player said #54 is holding his jersey during post play, could you please take a look at it?"
Others have also stated that if he is spending any energy worrying about the officials, he is not going to be the player his team needs him to be.

My Son has also started officiating and this is the exact advice I gave him. I believe being an official has helped him be a better player and vis-a-versa.

Great to hear about your son embarking on his officiating career. I get immense satisfaction partnering with my boys and watching from the stands while they manage a fast paced, pressure cooker game. I hope you are able to experience this unique pleasure soon and often.

I concur that judgement calls are off limits but many times an explanation given in response to a respectful question may provide for a teaching opportunity.

When my younger son was 10, he was called for a block. When he asked the ref what happened he was told he didn't give the dribbler a step and, even though he had good position that he was leaning backward and did not justify a charge.

My son's response was short and sweet 4---23---3

This official has since progressed to earn his Varsity stripes and we rehash that incident every time we meet. He refers to my son as his personal rules guru.

By the same token, my sons know the pat response to

Originally Posted by ChrisSportsFan

"could you watch their screens? I'm not sure they are staying set" or "my post player said #54 is holding his jersey during post play, could you please take a look at it?"

If they are going to engage in a tete-a-tete with a game official, it would probably be more in the vein of "Can the screener have his legs spread tthhiiiisssss wide?" or "Can you follow the airborne shooter til he lands safely?"
It would seem these are more salient comments and may lead to a better called game.

[Ref in PA]

I have said this before ... your sons are stuck the refs and their rules knowledge for the entire game. The rules knowledge of the refs will not improve during the game and may not improve before the next game. Understanding that fact will help them cope with any misapplication of any rule. If there is blatant misapplication of a rule, some refs might listen to a respectful question, but most I know will not. Your sons are going to have to read the personality of the refs on the game to know if they can be approached or not with a question.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by justacoach

When my younger son was 10, he was called for a block. When he asked the ref what happened he was told he didn't give the dribbler a step and, even though he had good position that he was leaning backward and did not justify a charge.

My son's response was short and sweet 4---23---3

Nobody likes a smart a$$. I would never encourage my child or congratulate her in a situation like this. I would ask her why she was engaging in a rules discussion during a game with an official. During a game, you aren't going to get the officials to change how they call a game or cause them to have a rules epiphany.

I work nothing but varsity ball these days and, to be honest, I can't remember who the captains are 5 minutes after the meeting. It's why I circle the captains' numbers in the book, just in case I need them later. In 20+ years, I've never gone back and looked for those numbers, but I have them, if needed.

I treat all players with the same respect they show me. They are welcome to talk to me anytime, but like I told the "captain" who wanted to whine about a block/charge and after I told him that we'll decide, not him, said, "but I'm a captain" -- being a captain doesn't give you a special right to whine and complain when you don't like a call.

[CJRef]

In my six years of working JV/Varsity I think I have talked to a designated captain only once or twice. I will listen to any player that addresses me respectfully and has a concern that they want me to pay more attention to. I don't think that I would ever speak with any player (captains included) about a kicked call or "mis-application" unless it is something we corrected or it was a confusing situation. And at that point, I think I would take the conversation to the coach.

It's good that they don't identify themselves as officials. I would stop listening to them even faster than when a coach says "Well I'm an official too and....". I guess if anything, I would say that their "knowledge" would best be used to educate their teammates and probably even the coach rather than engage the officials working their games.

[Big2Cat]

I officiate and still play in leagues. The only things I would ever bring to an officials attention are fixable things. For instance, we had an official blow his whistle on a loose ball (inadvertant), then tried to pretend it didn't happen, then tried to give it to the team that was closer to the ball.

Also, they might do other procedures incorrectly, and I will ask about those things--and don't feel bad for doing so. The handbook says that coaches, players, and officials should all know the rules. Nothing wrong with pointing out a specific rule.

Now, I don't go overboard with it, and I certainly don't get into judgment calls. If he says it is off me and I didn't touch it--nothing I can do about it. (Although if he says it is off the other team and I touched it last, I can tell him that.)

Anyhow, it is knowing what things they can bring up and what they can't. Most players don't know the rules, even the most basic things, so it would be a shock to an official that a player actually knows the rules. It is all in what is brought up and how. Leave emotions out if you disagree.

[coach41]

I also still play in leagues as well. One big difference in the leagues I play in are that we don't have many "professional" referees. The leagues have players ref the games instead. It's not to save money, but really to have players learn how hard it is to ref so they will WHINE less.

Personally, I think it's funny that I'm considered the "professional" ref in the leagues I play in. I consider myself just your regular "average Joe" ref. However, I guess in sheer numbers of games worked, I am a professional ref.