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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 03:35am
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Bulls-Pistons

I didn't see a thread on this already, so here goes...

I think it was early 3rd maybe late 2nd (watching the replay on ESPN at work, so I don't know exactly when this happened), Heinrich of the Bulls went airborn to catch a pass and contact the official who was out of bounds with his knee will catching the ball. Now I'm not calling the official out or anything because replays show him rubbing his head, looking like he is just trying to figure out where he was, but should this have been an OOB call and Pistons ball?

Don't have my FED with me, but I think its the same as NCAA which I pulled up online and 7.1 and 7.2 suggest OOB, as does NBA 8.1 and 8.2. I think where I'm doubting my interpretation is the wording is that a player is OOB when he is touching "the floor or any object other than a player on or outside the boundary line". Does "object" include the official. I know some officials might object to being called an object but we certainly aren't players. 7.2 or 8.2 certainly allows us to call it OOB if the ball touches us, but what about the player in control of the ball.

Or to be really silly if we aren't considering people to be objects, could a player have some of the offensive linemen from the football team lay down OOB and he walk across them to a spot OOB where the defender can't reach them and use this as a delay tactic. I know this is completely radical and there are rules to handle this, but based on the way 7.1 is written wouldn't it be legal excluding other objections that I'm sure will be mentioned. This very radical thought process led me to believe that contacting and official OOB while possessing the ball should be OOB.

I didn't check the FED case book, but the NCAA approved rulings don't cover the situation and the NBA casebook online isn't very organized in terms of finding specific rulings so if I'm way off base please point me in the right direction.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 07:25am
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FED rules / cases are clear that touching a person <> touching an object OOB.

Frankly, I think it's the "wrong" rule.

IDK and IDC what the NBA rule is.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 08:01am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NFHS Casebook
7.1.1 Ruling - To be out of bounds, A1 must touch the floor or some object on or outside a boundary line. People are not considered to be objects.
NBA rules don't seem to have this exception, but I'll wait until one of our pro rules experts comes by.

I agree with Bob, though, that the NFHS interpretation is incorrect - from both the rules and the metaphysics perspectives.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 12:54pm
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I saw the play in question, and even remember the official in question still rubbing his head during some free throws a minute or so later.

Anyhow, on the play in question, and I don't have a replay to review, but I'm not completely positive that said official was OOB. Anyone have a replay?
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 03:42pm
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No, he is not considered OOB, unless he tried to use the referee to keep himself from going OOB, which this was not the case. the only way this could have been OOB is if the ball was loose and it hit the ref with him being OOB.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 05:24pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btaylor64
No, he is not considered OOB, unless he tried to use the referee to keep himself from going OOB, which this was not the case. the only way this could have been OOB is if the ball was loose and it hit the ref with him being OOB.
Do you have a reference for this?
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 06:11pm
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Player Out Of Bounds, Or Not ...

2007-08 NFHS Casebook, Page 53, 7.1.1 Situation A: "People are not considered to be objects and play continues".
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 06:53pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Do you have a reference for this?
Well I don't have my NBA rule book or case book on me, but I can say it with 100% confidence that this is correct, especially in the play described.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 07:12pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by btaylor64
Well I don't have my NBA rule book or case book on me, but I can say it with 100% confidence that this is correct, especially in the play described.
I believe you, I'd just like to read what the rule actually is when you get the chance. I haven't been able to find it in the online rules.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 07:17pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
I believe you, I'd just like to read what the rule actually is when you get the chance. I haven't been able to find it in the online rules.
http://www.nba.com/analysis/rules_8....av=ArticleList

See 8-1

You're welcome
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 07:19pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee
Saw that, but was wondering more about the "official is not an object" and "A1 would be OOB if he touched the official in the process of keeping himself (A1) inbounds" interpretations.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 07:42pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Dexter
Saw that, but was wondering more about the "official is not an object" and "A1 would be OOB if he touched the official in the process of keeping himself (A1) inbounds" interpretations.
In the immortal words of Bob Jenkins "I don't know and I don't care."

It's the NBA. It's legal for a star but it's illegal for a scrubbie. And it's all Joey Crawford's fault anyway.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 09:30pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyMac
2007-08 NFHS Casebook, Page 53, 7.1.1 Situation A: "People are not considered to be objects and play continues".
Billy, where did you get the new NFHS Casebook? I would like to get one before our first association meeting. Thanks.
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Old Fri May 11, 2007, 09:50pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeTheRef
Billy, where did you get the new NFHS Casebook? I would like to get one before our first association meeting. Thanks.
According to the NF Website, the casebook is not ready until August. The Rulebook is not ready until July.

Here is the link below.

Does not come out until August

Peace
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Old Sat May 12, 2007, 12:09pm
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Sorry ..

Sorry, 2006-07 NFHS Casebook
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