Situation - help please

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by mick

...But [maybe] with shots.

Can you clarify?

[mick]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

Can you clarify?

In an obviously poorly written response to Mark T calling a team control a common foul, which it is, I metaphorically miscued an exemplary example of why the common foul is not a straight-up match to the definition of a PC/TC.

I guess my post was not intuitively obvious to every casual observer with it being common knowledge that free throws are not awarded on TC/PC fouls.

But I am really sorry I even posted.

Sorry !

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by mick

In an obviously poorly written response to Mark T calling a team control a common foul, which it is, I metaphorically miscued an exemplary example of why the common foul is not a straight-up match to the definition of a PC/TC.

I guess my post was not intuitively obvious to every casual observer with it being common knowledge that free throws are not awarded on TC/PC fouls.

But I am really sorry I even posted.

Sorry !

No problem, I understand, but others may not.

[FrankHtown]

I know you think I understood what you were trying to say, etc, etc, etc

[mick]

Originally Posted by FrankHtown

I know you think I understood what you were trying to say, etc, etc, etc

I hear that, Franktown !!

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by DC_Ref12

Team B is in the bonus. A1 is driving towards his basket when B1 establishes LGP in A1's path. A1 jumps in the air to attempt a shot but before contacting B1, passes the ball off. While the ball is in the air between A1 and A2, A1 contacts B1 and sends them both to the floor.

IF you have a foul here, what is your call?

a) PC foul on A1, no FTs
b) Team control foul, no FTs
c) common foul, B1 to shoot FT(s)

As others have said...b. But, now that we have the TC foul, it is almost redundant to have the PC foul too. In all but one case, they are exactly the same.

The team control foul is a common foul commited by a player on the team that has control of the ball. A player holding or dribbling the ball technically commits a PC foul but nothing about it is differnet than the TC foul...same action, same time period, same penalty, just that the player also has player control.

The ONLY part that is different is the airborne shooter part.

They could effectively combine the TC and PC rules into a singe type of foul and add the airborne shooter clause to cover that and they'd have only one rule.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

They could effectively combine the TC and PC rules into a singe type of foul and add the airborne shooter clause to cover that and they'd have only one rule.

How about:

An offensive foul is a common foul
a. committed by a player while holding or dribbling the ball inbounds;
b. committed by a player whose team has team control at the time of the foul;
c. committed by an airborne shooter;
d. committed during a throw-in by a player on the team entitled to the throw-in, until the ball is controlled inbounds.

("d." is kind of awkward, but it's shorter than "committed by a player whose team is entitled to a throw-in; such foul being committed after the ball has become live to begin the throw-in and before the ball is controlled inbounds".)

MAJOR DISCLAIMER: This is NOT the current rule. It's my suggestion for how to re-write the rule so that we would have one type of foul for all "offensive"-type fouls, which might -- someday -- include fouls by the offense during a throw-in. Sorry for the confusion!

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

How about:

An offensive foul is a common foul
a. committed by a player while holding or dribbling the ball inbounds;
b. committed by a player whose team has team control at the time of the foul;
c. committed by an airborne shooter;
d. committed during a throw-in by a player on the team entitled to the throw-in, until the ball is controlled inbounds.

("d." is kind of awkward, but it's shorter than "committed by a player whose team is entitled to a throw-in; such foul being committed after the ball has become live to begin the throw-in and before the ball is controlled inbounds".)

Um, dont think there is team control in HS on throw-ins. You might want to check statement D.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

Um, dont think there is team control in HS on throw-ins. You might want to check statement D.

You might want to check the thread on the new NFHS rules...

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

You might want to check the thread on the new NFHS rules...

Oh are the new rule in effect now or when the season begins?

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

Oh are the new rule in effect now or when the season begins?

Well, around here we use start using them at all of our summer camps and clinics so coaches and players get used to them before next November when it counts...so I would say they are in effect now.

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Well, around here we use start using them at all of our summer camps and clinics so coaches and players get used to them before next November when it counts...so I would say they are in effect now.

My mistake then!

[FrankHtown]

The only change having to do with throw-in's is that the throw-in ends when the ball is "legally" touched. I don't think they changed the status of no team control during a throw-in.

[Vinski]

Originally Posted by Scrapper1

How about:

An offensive foul is a common foul...
d. committed during a throw-in by a player on the team entitled to the throw-in, until the ball is controlled inbounds.

Team control (offensive foul) during a throw-in?? For NFHS?? Really?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Vinski

Team control (offensive foul) during a throw-in?? For NFHS?? Really?

Really! Scrappy was talking about how the rule could possibly be re-written to combine PC and TC fouls, not what the rule actually is now. Neither you or IREFU2 comprehended that.