NFHS New Rules are posted

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by socalreff

We use college rules governing the shot clock...

You are mistaken. You many think that you use the NCAA rules for the shot clock in CA HS games, but in truth your official policy is to employ the rules modifications published in the CBOA manual which were written by Bill White.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

You are mistaken. You many think that you use the NCAA rules for the shot clock in CA HS games, but in truth your official policy is to employ the rules modifications published in the CBOA manual which were written by Bill White.

Can you explain why they do not use NCAA Rules? What are the differences?

Peace

[socalreff]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Can you explain why they do not use NCAA Rules? What are the differences?

Peace

"The rules governing the shot clock for high school basketball are the same as those used in NCAA Men and Womens games with one exception: a kicked ball results in a full reset of the shot clock."

Various reasons led to the use of the shot clock. Speed of play, as well as, preparation for the next level are a couple. Also, it helps officials tremendously in clock awareness and game management going into the college ranks. At most college camps around the country, there is no shot clock. It's definitely one of the things that's hard to tell at camp for assignors whether an official is a good clock manager. For us, it's ingrained in us from freshmen level all the way up.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by socalreff

"The rules governing the shot clock for high school basketball are the same as those used in NCAA Men and Womens games with one exception: a kicked ball results in a full reset of the shot clock."

Various reasons led to the use of the shot clock. Speed of play, as well as, preparation for the next level are a couple. Also, it helps officials tremendously in clock awareness and game management going into the college ranks. At most college camps around the country, there is no shot clock. It's definitely one of the things that's hard to tell at camp for assignors whether an official is a good clock manager. For us, it's ingrained in us from freshmen level all the way up.

I was not responding to you. I was asking this question of the person whose quote was also in the post. Once again, I trust the person that lives in the particular state to know more than someone that does not. Personally I have very little opinion about the shot clock at the HS level. If they ever go to it where I live, I would be OK with it. If they never changed the rule, I would be OK with that too.

Peace

[socalreff]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I was not responding to you. I was asking this question of the person whose quote was also in the post. Once again, I trust the person that lives in the particular state to know more than someone that does not. Personally I have very little opinion about the shot clock at the HS level. If they ever go to it where I live, I would be OK with it. If they never changed the rule, I would be OK with that too.

Peace

Thanks. Do you see situations during games where you wish there was one? I remember a few times where a team stalled because they felt they couldn't keep up. Also, I saw teams stall just because they didn't like their opponent -- one time a team threw the ball in to start the quarter and held for the last shot . Talk about trying to stay awake!!!

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by socalreff

Thanks. Do you see situations during games where you wish there was one?

Nope. Personally if I saw a game where a team used the "stall," I would not be upset. The team is just making it easy for me.

Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Nope. Personally if I saw a game where a team used the "stall," I would not be upset. The team is just making it easy for me.

Agree. What we personally like or dislike isn't germane or relevant to the way that we call the game. If what a team is doing is legal, there's no reason to get involved. And you sureasheck can't make any valid argument in favor of getting involved in something that is legal and none of your business either(like a coach hollering at one of his players ).

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by socalreff

Thanks. Do you see situations during games where you wish there was one? I remember a few times where a team stalled because they felt they couldn't keep up. Also, I saw teams stall just because they didn't like their opponent -- one time a team threw the ball in to start the quarter and held for the last shot . Talk about trying to stay awake!!!

Washington does the same thing...shot clock for girls but not for boys. HAve had some games on the boys side where I wished there was one - team stalling, final score in the teens, and some girls games where I wished there wasn't one - final score 107-11 and they had to shoot or it would be a turnover...

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by rockyroad

Washington does the same thing...shot clock for girls but not for boys.

Just curious - do you use the shot clock or not in games played by hermaphrodites?

[socalreff]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

You are mistaken. You many think that you use the NCAA rules for the shot clock in CA HS games, but in truth your official policy is to employ the rules modifications published in the CBOA manual which were written by Bill White.

I am not mistaken. Next time you can use my whole quote..... we do use the NCAA rules regarding the shot clock except for the kicked ball which only became different when the NCAA changed the rule a couple years ago. And there was talk even at that time that the kicked ball rule would change for the high school level as well. As late as a month before the season it was to be implemented until we received a directive from Dr. White that CIF would keep the kick rule as it was. Dr. White told me he took the rules straight from the NCAA. If you can find anything in the CBOA manual that shows it being any different from NCAA, let me know. Directly off page 22 in the handbook --
"The rules governing the shot clock for high school basketball are the same as those used in NCAA Men and Womens games with one exception: a kicked ball results in a full reset of the shot clock."

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by socalreff

"The rules governing the shot clock for high school basketball are the same as those used in NCAA Men and Womens games with one exception: a kicked ball results in a full reset of the shot clock."

Do not worry. It is not the first time he comes out all big and bold only to be wrong. That is why I asked a follow-up question. I trust people that actually work in that state than someone that only reads about what goes on in that state.

Peace

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by socalreff

I am not mistaken. Next time you can use my whole quote..... we do use the NCAA rules regarding the shot clock except for the kicked ball which only became different when the NCAA changed the rule a couple years ago. And there was talk even at that time that the kicked ball rule would change for the high school level as well. As late as a month before the season it was to be implemented until we received a directive from Dr. White that CIF would keep the kick rule as it was. Dr. White told me he took the rules straight from the NCAA. If you can find anything in the CBOA manual that shows it being any different from NCAA, let me know. Directly off page 22 in the handbook --
"The rules governing the shot clock for high school basketball are the same as those used in NCAA Men and Womens games with one exception: a kicked ball results in a full reset of the shot clock."

I'm traveling to Vegas this weekend, but it seems that I have some research to do when I return. The three NV officials associations used to be part of the CBOA. (You paying attention here Rut! Also some of the members of my NV association work CA games in the Sacramento area and a few of us have even worked CIF postseason games. So not only did we register there, but also worked there.) We left just prior to the start of last season due to the new insurance deal that the CBOA decided to sign with the NFHS. So we used to get the CBOA manual, but did not this past season. Therefore, it is entirely possible that this sentence on page 22 is new and I was not aware of it. I'll have to check. CA may NOW use NCAA rules for its shot clock, whereas they did not before.
PS Your whole quote was not the issue. I granted you the fact that there is a difference on a kicked ball and you clearly stated such. There used to be many other differences which were subtle. For example, could you look in the new book and tell me how the shot clock is handled when a double personal foul occurs with the offensive team in control? That used to be one difference between the NCAA and CBOA shot clock rules.

[socalreff]

Originally Posted by Nevadaref

I'm traveling to Vegas this weekend, but it seems that I have some research to do when I return. The three NV officials associations used to be part of the CBOA. (You paying attention here Rut! Also some of the members of my NV association work CA games in the Sacramento area and a few of us have even worked CIF postseason games. So not only did we register there, but also worked there.) We left just prior to the start of last season due to the new insurance deal that the CBOA decided to sign with the NFHS. So we used to get the CBOA manual, but did not this past season. Therefore, it is entirely possible that this sentence on page 22 is new and I was not aware of it. I'll have to check. CA may NOW use NCAA rules for its shot clock, whereas they did not before.
PS Your whole quote was not the issue. I granted you the fact that there is a difference on a kicked ball and you clearly stated such. There used to be many other differences which were subtle. For example, could you look in the new book and tell me how the shot clock is handled when a double personal foul occurs with the offensive team in control? That used to be one difference between the NCAA and CBOA shot clock rules.

The deal we signed was with NASO not NFHS.
The shot clock is not reset on a double foul if there is team control, just like NCAA.