Whose Ball?

[Rick Durkee]

Two whistle crew. NFHS rules.

I was the trail during a frontcourt, end line throw-in. The throw-in went to A1 who was in the frontcourt, near the division line. The throw-in "squirted" through the hands of A1 and into the backcourt. In my opinion, A1 never had control. A1 pursued the ball with B1 about 10 feet behind him. A1 caught up with the ball near the top of the three-point circle and, apparently believing it would be a backcourt violation (And frustration? And not knowing what else to do?), batted the ball toward his frontcourt and right to B1. At some time after A1 batted the ball, my partner blew his whistle. I looked at him, and he called a backcourt violation. Already looking appropriately sheepish, my partner approached me and said something like, "That wasn't backcourt, was it?" I told to him that I didn't believe it was because I didn't think Team A had control of the ball. My partner acknowledged that he had blown it. I decided that my partner had blown his whistle before B1 had control of the ball, and we used the AP arrow to determine possession. I assume that was correct. My question is, what if B1 did clearly have control of the ball when my partner blew his whistle? Should we have gone to the arrow because the ball was dead when my partner thought a violation occurred? Or, do should we have given it to Team B because they had control at the time of the "inadvertent whistle"?

[cmathews]

your partner thinking that there was a violation doesn't make it dead. What makes it dead is his whistle. If B1 had the ball when the whistle blew it should be B1's ball

[Mark Padgett]

When I saw the title of this post, I thought it would be a discussion of what to say when players came out to start a quarter and ask "whose ball?"

When that happens (and it happens all the time, as you know), I usually look down at the ball then say, "some kid named Wilson (or Baden, etc.)".

Sometimes they get it.

[Camron Rust]

While the ball does becomes dead at the point of an infraction, I'd say in this case, it doesn't become dead until the whistle since there was no infraction. If the ball was in B1's hands at the time of the whistle, B gets the ball.

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Rick Durkee

Two whistle crew. NFHS rules.

I was the trail during a frontcourt, end line throw-in. The throw-in went to A1 who was in the frontcourt, near the division line. The throw-in "squirted" through the hands of A1 and into the backcourt. In my opinion, A1 never had control. A1 pursued the ball with B1 about 10 feet behind him. A1 caught up with the ball near the top of the three-point circle and, apparently believing it would be a backcourt violation (And frustration? And not knowing what else to do?), batted the ball toward his frontcourt and right to B1. At some time after A1 batted the ball, my partner blew his whistle. I looked at him, and he called a backcourt violation. Already looking appropriately sheepish, my partner approached me and said something like, "That wasn't backcourt, was it?" I told to him that I didn't believe it was because I didn't think Team A had control of the ball. My partner acknowledged that he had blown it. I decided that my partner had blown his whistle before B1 had control of the ball, and we used the AP arrow to determine possession. I assume that was correct. My question is, what if B1 did clearly have control of the ball when my partner blew his whistle? Should we have gone to the arrow because the ball was dead when my partner thought a violation occurred? Or, do should we have given it to Team B because they had control at the time of the "inadvertent whistle"?

With the exception of the Lead blowing his whistle, you guys did it right. The throw-in had ended, so that isn't the POI. There was no team control yet, so neither team gets the ball for that by POI. AP is the only way to go.

Even though there is the fundamental that the whistle seldom causes the ball to become dead and it is already dead, as Camron said that doesn't apply here because there was no violation. Thinking that there is a violation is not the same as one actually occurring.

If B had been able to gain control prior to the whistle they would get a throw-in under the POI rule.

[zebra44]

Good explanation Nevadaref.....

[Rick Durkee]

Thanks folks!