Venting

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Terrapins Fan

Here's something that happened to me. I am doing a JV game ( boys ) After a call, the varsity coach sitting opposite the team bench, said " You will Never work one of my games", then later made a comment about one of my calls
( and the call was right) I never acknowledged him, but it got under my skin.

what do you think? ignore or acknowledge?

If I knew it was the varsity coach saying this. I would stop the game and ask him, "what did you just say?" If he repeats it. I would say, okay. I'm going to speak with the A/D about that comment. Guaranteed that will shut him up for the rest of the game. After the game, go home. Now, if the coach happens to be the A/D too. Home JV team getting a technical. Talk to my assigner about it afterwards.

For those that may ask. Let me answer it right now. Shoot 2 shots, give the ball back to the visiting team. Do not seat belt the JV coach. Nice thing about college is you can give a fan a technical. It does not count as a team foul or indirect to the head coach. Nice, but of course if you're too afraid to address the fan, well, you got problems. Might want to look at a different hobby.

[deecee]

Old I really would like some specifics on where and what level you do -- because even I am flabbergasted -- The only way I could see myself giving fans a T was if they were throwing stuff onto the court and WE had already asked them to stop via the PA system by the Head coach or game management. But fans getting a T from what I have been taught is a HUGH NONO -- and that is coming from NBA, D1, D2 top HS officials, assignors the works. The FANS have to earn that technical 3 or 4 times over before they actually get it. Just what I have been told.

[mplagrow]

I agree. I've never seen it called in about 1000 games I've reffed or coached. I've HEARD of it being called once, and that was a fiasco that never should have happened and should never be repeated.

[SmokeEater]

Originally Posted by mplagrow

I agree. I've never seen it called in about 1000 games I've reffed or coached. I've HEARD of it being called once, and that was a fiasco that never should have happened and should never be repeated.

That must have been the ONE game OS was reffing.

I swore to myself I would never enter into one of these but I can't resist anymore.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

1) If I knew it was the varsity coach saying this. I would stop the game and ask him, "what did you just say?" If he repeats it. I would say, okay. I'm going to speak with the A/D about that comment. Guaranteed that will shut him up for the rest of the game.

2) After the game, go home.

1) Why didn't you just give him "The Stare"?

2) Great advice.

[IREFU2]

I have only done this one time in my career as an official. It was a Girls Varsity Summer Camp and the fan was a parent of one of the players. He was being very nasty and sitting behind the table on the second row. The table was complaining and I asked him to be removed and since it was a camp, they wouldnt do it. So, I spoke with the coach of the team that his daughter played on. I told the coach that he could earn a "t" for his fan. The coached talked with him and he said the hell with the F@#$ing officials out loud. So we "t" the coach and then the coach asked him to leave or his daughter was on the bench for the rest of the season. Needless to say, he left. Of course those that dont know the rule gave me a hard time about that later on when they heard about it!!!

[deecee]

i agree with you IREF in this case -- you had no choice -- but great job of the coach to own up and at least offer some kind of threat to remedy the situation -- most coaches would have b*tched about it and earned #2.

[Old School]

NCAA Rule - been there a long time....

Section 5. Indirect Technical Fouls for Unsportsmanlike Conduct by Followers
Any follower(s) of a team shall be assessed an indirect technical foul for
unsportsmanlike conduct that includes but is not limited to the following:

Art. 4. Disrespectfully addressing an official, which includes the use of
profanity or language that is abusive, vulgar or obscene.
Art. 5. Using electronic transmission to communicate with those in the bench
area or passing knowledge acquired with the use of electronic instruments
(e.g., headsets, cellular telephones, modular telephones, television, radio,
Internet video or visual broadcast) to and from the bench area.

Section 6. Penalty for Unsportsmanlike Conduct by Followers

Art. 1. The penalty for an indirect technical foul assessed to a follower(s)
shall be two free throws awarded to a player of the offended team. The ball
shall be put back in play at the point of interruption.
Art. 2. Indirect technical fouls shall not count toward the team-foul total
nor shall they be charged to any specific team member.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

NCAA Rule - been there a long time....

Section 5. Indirect Technical Fouls for Unsportsmanlike Conduct by Followers
Any follower(s) of a team shall be assessed an indirect technical foul for
unsportsmanlike conduct that includes but is not limited to the following:

Art. 4. Disrespectfully addressing an official, which includes the use of
profanity or language that is abusive, vulgar or obscene.
Art. 5. Using electronic transmission to communicate with those in the bench
area or passing knowledge acquired with the use of electronic instruments
(e.g., headsets, cellular telephones, modular telephones, television, radio,
Internet video or visual broadcast) to and from the bench area.

Section 6. Penalty for Unsportsmanlike Conduct by Followers

Art. 1. The penalty for an indirect technical foul assessed to a follower(s)
shall be two free throws awarded to a player of the offended team. The ball
shall be put back in play at the point of interruption.
Art. 2. Indirect technical fouls shall not count toward the team-foul total
nor shall they be charged to any specific team member.

Please cite the applicable NFHS rule and case play also. Othere readers may want to know that also.

[deecee]

Right because there is never a "Ref you 2#$#@ suck" in a college game that the ref hears and he goes on and Ts the fan up (or home coach whatever) -- please your ability to read the rulebook is superb however your ability to apply judgement failry and equitably is horrible.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Please cite the applicable NFHS rule and case play also. Othere readers may want to know that also.

I'll leave that up to you Mr. Knowitall, since you are the one requesting it. I've prove my point. Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

I'll leave that up to you Mr. Knowitall, since you are the one requesting it. I've prove my point.

Me too. You still don't own an NFHS rule book or case book, do you?

[Old School]

Originally Posted by deecee

Right because there is never a "Ref you 2#$#@ suck" in a college game that the ref hears and he goes on and Ts the fan up (or home coach whatever) -- please your ability to read the rulebook is superb however your ability to apply judgement failry and equitably is horrible.

Deecee, what are you talking about?

If, in a HS jv game I am working, the head coach is sitting in the stands watching the game, and the HC says to me after a call I just made, you will never work in my gym again. In my judgement, he has just cross the line, and if he's the A/D and the coach, his JV teams getting a technical. If that's horrible judgement to you, then I am lucky I don't have to work with you. There is code in the NFHS rules book that talks about giving the home team a technical if fans are out of control. I think this would apply, but, that's just me. Peace

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Old School

If, in a HS jv game I am working, the head coach is stilling in the stands watching the game, and the HC says to me after a call I just made, you will never work in my gym again. In my judgement, he has just cross the line, and if he's the A/D and the coach, his JV teams getting a technical. If that's horrible judgement to you, then I am lucky I don't have to work with you. There is code in the NFHS rules book that talks about giving the home team a technical if fans are out of control. I think this would apply, but, that's just me.

The "code" that you are talking about is NFHS case book play 2.8.1. The way that I read that case play, it doesn't really seem to agree at all with the way that you suggest handling the situation above. And....that's exactly why I asked you to cite that particular case play. I was wondering why you would ignore the advice given out by the FED in that case play. Which naturally lead to me wondering if you actually know what is contained in that case play.

So....do you know what the recommended procedure is in the case play? If so, please cite it... similar to the NCAA citation that you gave to us.

[Old School]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The "code" that you are talking about is NFHS case book play 2.8.1. The way that I read that case play, it doesn't really seem to agree at all with the way that you suggest handling the situation above. And....that's exactly why I asked you to cite that particular case play. I was wondering why you would ignore the advice given out by the FED in that case play. Which naturally lead to me wondering if you actually know what is contained in that case play.

So....do you know what the recommended procedure is in the case play? If so, please cite it... similar to the NCAA citation that you gave to us.

Don't have time to debate your nonsense. I have bigger fish to fry. Do whatever you think is the right thing to do here. I know what I'm going to do. Peace