Back court violation?

[Hardwood]

Player A1 attempts a shot and the ball rebounds long toward the sideline. A2 jumps to save the ball and with one hand, throws the ball into A's backcourt. A3 is the first to touch in the backcourt. A2's action was more than a slap. He kind of palmed or cupped the ball with one hand.

I determined that it was not player control and therefore, no violation. Judging from the reaction of the home coach and home crowd, I was in the minority.

Hardwood

[amcginthy]

Originally Posted by Hardwood

Player A1 attempts a shot and the ball rebounds long toward the sideline. A2 jumps to save the ball and with one hand, throws the ball into A's backcourt. A3 is the first to touch in the backcourt. A2's action was more than a slap. He kind of palmed or cupped the ball with one hand.

I determined that it was not player control and therefore, no violation. Judging from the reaction of the home coach and home crowd, I was in the minority.

Hardwood

First, I'm not sure what the question is... if your determination is that there was no player control - then my understanding of the rule is (remember, I'm a coach, not a ref) - you got it right. The opposing coach just didn't like the call - doesn't mean it was wrong...

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Hardwood

Player A1 attempts a shot and the ball rebounds long toward the sideline. A2 jumps to save the ball and with one hand, throws the ball into A's backcourt. A3 is the first to touch in the backcourt. A2's action was more than a slap. He kind of palmed or cupped the ball with one hand.

I determined that it was not player control and therefore, no violation. Judging from the reaction of the home coach and home crowd, I was in the minority.

It was, and is, a judgement call. If you felt that the ball came to rest in A2's hand, he had player control. So....if you judged A2 had player control when he threw the ball to the backcourt, a violation would be the correct call. No player control---> no violation.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Hardwood

Player A1 attempts a shot and the ball rebounds long toward the sideline. A2 jumps to save the ball and with one hand, throws the ball into A's backcourt. A3 is the first to touch in the backcourt. A2's action was more than a slap. He kind of palmed or cupped the ball with one hand.

I determined that it was not player control and therefore, no violation. Judging from the reaction of the home coach and home crowd, I was in the minority.

Hardwood

If A2 had requested a timeout while he was touching the ball, would you have granted it?

[IREFU2]

You are correct, once it was in the air, both team and player control was terminated. No backcourt.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

You are correct, once it was in the air, both team and player control was terminated. No backcourt.

Once what was in the air?

[Ray_from_Mi]

Jurassic is right on here. Judgement call, most fans believe any touch = control, that why they probably weren't up for what you did next.

[Scrapper1]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Once what was in the air?

IREFU2 is talking about the shot that preceeded the throw/bat into the backcourt. Once the shot is released, team control is obviously terminated. The real question is whether the ball was then caught and thrown, or merely batted to the backcourt.

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Once what was in the air?

That 29.5 ounce of round rubber that is called a ball!!!!! You know its color shall be the approved orange shade or natural color. It shall be spherical. It shall have a deeply-pebbled cover with horizontally shaped panels bonded tightly to the rubber carcass. Sound familiar?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

That 29.5 ounce of round rubber that is called a ball!!!!! You know its color shall be the approved orange shade or natural color. It shall be spherical. It shall have a deeply-pebbled cover with horizontally shaped panels bonded tightly to the rubber carcass. Sound familiar?

Yup. Now whatintheheck has that got to do with what we're discussing? We know that player and team control was lost with the shot. The question is whether a new player control was established on the rebound. If player control was established, then there sureasheck is a backcourt violation.

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yup. Now whatintheheck has that got to do with what we're discussing?

"Splain that to me.....

Read Scrapper1's post, maybe the light will come on.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

Read Scrapper1's post, maybe the light will come on.

The light was always on. Now maybe you can explain your statement. You said that once the ball was in the air, there was no player or team control, and thus no backcourt violation. That statement is wrong. If A2 established player control on the rebound, the rules say that there is a backcourt violation.

[IREFU2]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Yup. Now whatintheheck has that got to do with what we're discussing? We know that player and team control was lost with the shot. The question is whether a new player control was established on the rebound. If player control was established, then there sureasheck is a backcourt violation.

Read the initial post.....it was his judgement...not ours.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Originally Posted by IREFU2

Read Scrapper1's post, maybe the light will come on.

I've got to say that I'm slightly confused by your post as well. (I actually said "Once WHAT was in the air?" outloud just before scrolling down to Jurassic's first post. Funny.) Do you mean once the try is released there's no player/team control, and thus no violation? If so, you're still ignoring the possibility, as others have stated, that player and therefore team control was re-established when A2 passed/batted the ball into the backcourt. Judgement, I know, but the possibility is there - it's not black and white. I believe rainmaker had this very same play (on the baseline, however, if I recall) recently, and ruled control and subsequent violation. Could go either way, in most of these, but if a player is able to palm/cup the ball with the hand and heave it, I'm inclined to think that, more often than not, there's player control there. Bob's question, as a determining factor, is a good one, as well.