Fans on sideline is touched with ball

[kycat1]

Help with this. Has not happened yet, but will in the future.
Fan walking up sideline in small gym. Half on the court and half off. A1 dribbling the ball up the court. Ball hits fan that is touching 1/2 on & off the playable court. Is ball OOB? And if yes, then does B get the ball? I don't have my book today, please give ruling number. Thanks

[Jurassic Referee]

The ball is OOB as per rule 7-1-2(b). It sounds like the the fan interfered with play. If so, give team A the ball back for a throw-in. Use case book play 7.1.2SitB(a) as a guideline. Almost the same situation.

[Mark Padgett]

Don't forget to toss the fan.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The ball is OOB as per rule 7-1-2(b). It sounds like the the fan interfered with play. If so, give team A the ball back for a throw-in. Use case book play 7.1.2SitB(a) as a guideline. Almost the same situation.

This was a hypothetical situation, not a real one. I'm surprised you assumed the fan deliberately interfered with no evidence other than walking half on and off court. I've been in gyms where it's almost impossible to get back to your seat without walking along the sideline.

7-1-2(b) just says the ball is OOB, presumably off of A1 who was dribbling. A1 should watch where he/she is dribbling.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

This was a hypothetical situation, not a real one. I'm surprised you assumed the fan deliberately interfered with no evidence other than walking half on and off court. I've been in gyms where it's almost impossible to get back to your seat without walking along the sideline.

7-1-2(b) just says the ball is OOB, presumably off of A1 who was dribbling. A1 should watch where he/she is dribbling.

Are you saying that you would give team B the ball?

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Are you saying that you would give team B the ball?

I'm going to have to review the case book citation you mentioned. But that was my interpretation of the rule. A1 caused the ball to go out of bounds. Sort of like Jeffrey Meyers. Home run or fan interference?

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The ball is OOB as per rule 7-1-2(b). It sounds like the the fan interfered with play. If so, give team A the ball back for a throw-in. Use case book play 7.1.2SitB(a) as a guideline. Almost the same situation.

7-1-2 . . . The ball is out of bounds when it touches or is touched by:
a. A player who is out of bounds.
b. Any other person, the floor, or any object on or outside a boundary.

I agree with JR. Whether the fan interference is deliberate or not doesn't matter. The fact that the fan is partially in the court does. The fan shouldn't be there, but sometimes circumstances dictate otherwise. Therefore, instead of a strict enforcement of 7-1-2, which was not intended to cover this situation, use 2-3 to stop play and give Team A a throw-in.

Now if the fan were completely OOB, then I would simply follow 7-1-2.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

The ball is OOB as per rule 7-1-2(b). It sounds like the the fan interfered with play. If so, give team A the ball back for a throw-in. Use case book play 7.1.2SitB(a) as a guideline. Almost the same situation.

This case is talking about hitting a player in the game (B1). A fan is not a player. The ball is out of bounds, and A1 caused it to be out of bounds. Who gets the ball?

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

This case is talking about hitting a player in the game (B1). A fan is not a player. The ball is out of bounds, and A1 caused it to be out of bounds. Who gets the ball?

How did A1 cause the ball to OOB if he was dribbling it in-bounds? The fan caused the ball to go OOB by interfering with the play. Whether that interference was deliberate or not has no bearing on the play either.

There is no wayinhell you can logically charge A1 with a violation under R9-3-1. Again, the fan caused the ball to go OOB, not A1.

If the fan came 4 feet onto the floor and knocked the ball OOB, would you call a violation on A1 too?

Just give the ball back to team A.

Lah me......

[Nevadaref]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

If the fan came 4 feet onto the floor and knocked the ball OOB, would you call a violation on A1 too?

Lah me......

Great example.

Of course, some fool is going to tell you not to charge the team associated with this supporter with a technical foul.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

How did A1 cause the ball to OOB if he was dribbling it in-bounds? The fan caused the ball to go OOB by interfering with the play. Whether that interference was deliberate or not has no bearing on the play either.

There is no wayinhell you can logically charge A1 with a violation under R9-3-1. Again, the fan caused the ball to go OOB, not A1.

If the fan came 4 feet onto the floor and knocked the ball OOB, would you call a violation on A1 too?

Just give the ball back to team A.

Lah me......

If you want to make things up, then fine. The rules you cited say otherwise and the case you cited has nothing to do with the play. BTW the fan who is straddling the line is technically OOB, not inbounds. So by hitting the fan, he is dribbling it OOB. I also can't follow why you are saying that the fan hit the ball when the OP says the ball hit the fan.

Unless you've got a better rule citation than the ones you've given, then you have to give the ball to B.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

Unless you've got a better rule citation than the ones you've given, then you have to give the ball to B.

Jim, I'd cut my own nuts off before I'd give the ball to team B in this situation.

The ball would not have gone OOB except for the fan interference. You don't penalize a team for fan interference either. Well..... I thought that you don't. Apparently, I was wrong. There's at least one official that would.

Unbelievable.......

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally Posted by kycat1

Help with this. Has not happened yet, but will in the future.
Fan walking up sideline in small gym. Half on the court and half off. A1 dribbling the ball up the court. Ball hits fan that is touching 1/2 on & off the playable court. Is ball OOB? And if yes, then does B get the ball? I don't have my book today, please give ruling number. Thanks

I've reffed in gyms where there was only room for fans to stand/sit 1 deep against the wall, and could conceivably see this very thing happening. Personally, I'm letting play continue, and if the ball hitting the fan causes interference with the play, I'm giving it back to team A.

[GoodwillRef]

Originally Posted by Whistles & Stripes

I've reffed in gyms where there was only room for fans to stand/sit 1 deep against the wall, and could conceivably see this very thing happening. Personally, I'm letting play continue, and if the ball hitting the fan causes interference with the play, I'm giving it back to team A.

What? A fan touches the ball and you have a "play on?" Come on...are you really serious?

[WhistlesAndStripes]

Originally Posted by GoodwillRef

What? A fan touches the ball and you have a "play on?" Come on...are you really serious?

In the gym's I'm talking about, I'm totally serious. And the OP didn't say that the fan touched the ball, it said the ball hit the fan.