The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sun Oct 22, 2006, 10:05pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 944
Charge, but shot counts?

I saw an interesting call tonight in a NYC boys all-star game. Both teams in double bonus, last minute of the game, three-man crew, top of the line for all-star game. A1 drives toward the right baseline, passes off into the lane, A1 runs into B1, A2 dunks the ball, L1 calls charge on the player that passed, L2 signals the basket good. Officials huddle, end result - team foul, no other penalty on A, basket counts.

I know that the rule is now no FTs on a team foul. The only penalty is a personal foul, in this case on a player that only had 1 foul. Doesn't seem like much of a penalty to me.

Don't ask me whether the shot happened before the charge. I would say no, but it would be a guess. I think you'd need stop action slo mo to tell for sure.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sun Oct 22, 2006, 10:16pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Western Mass.
Posts: 9,105
Send a message via AIM to ChuckElias
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimgolf
I saw an interesting call tonight in a NYC boys all-star game. Both teams in double bonus, last minute of the game, three-man crew, top of the line for all-star game. A1 drives toward the right baseline, passes off into the lane, A1 runs into B1, A2 dunks the ball, L1 calls charge on the player that passed, L2 signals the basket good. Officials huddle, end result - team foul, no other penalty on A, basket counts.
Oops.
__________________
Any NCAA rules and interpretations in this post are relevant for men's games only!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sun Oct 22, 2006, 10:44pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,910
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimgolf

Don't ask me whether the shot happened before the charge. I would say no, but it would be a guess. I think you'd need stop action slo mo to tell for sure.
Well since it was an all-star game, maybe they were just setting the rules aside for entertainment value. If the shot happened before the charge, then the ball would have been dead and you can't call a personal foul. If the shot had been released, there was no more team control so no team control foul. If the contact happened first, then you can't allow the shot. However, sometimes in all-star games, entertainment rules.
__________________
"To learn, you have to listen. To improve, you have to try." (Thomas Jefferson)
Z
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sun Oct 22, 2006, 11:13pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,616
You can't do both; score the basket and call a team control foul.

If the shot is good, then there's no team control when the foul occurs.

If there's team control, then the shot can't count.
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Mon Oct 23, 2006, 07:13am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,673
Send a message via MSN to IREFU2 Send a message via Yahoo to IREFU2
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimgolf
I saw an interesting call tonight in a NYC boys all-star game. Both teams in double bonus, last minute of the game, three-man crew, top of the line for all-star game. A1 drives toward the right baseline, passes off into the lane, A1 runs into B1, A2 dunks the ball, L1 calls charge on the player that passed, L2 signals the basket good. Officials huddle, end result - team foul, no other penalty on A, basket counts.

I know that the rule is now no FTs on a team foul. The only penalty is a personal foul, in this case on a player that only had 1 foul. Doesn't seem like much of a penalty to me.

Don't ask me whether the shot happened before the charge. I would say no, but it would be a guess. I think you'd need stop action slo mo to tell for sure.
OMG!!!!!
__________________
Score the Basket!!!!
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Mon Oct 23, 2006, 08:42am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 944
Maybe I explained this poorly, but the shot was a dunk, so the shot wasn't released until it was in.

I guess what I was asking was, if the shot was good, and the player who passed the ball charged into his defender (knocking him out of bounds, BTW), what should the call be? And penalties?

Sorry, I just saw the airborne passer thread - I'll check that for similarities.

Last edited by Jimgolf; Mon Oct 23, 2006 at 08:45am.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Mon Oct 23, 2006, 08:46am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 339
If the charge occurred as he passed the ball, then the charge was first, shot does not count..
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon Oct 23, 2006, 08:48am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 14,616
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimgolf
Maybe I explained this poorly, but the shot was a dunk, so the shot wasn't released until it was in.

I guess what I was asking was, if the shot was good, and the player who passed the ball charged into his defender (knocking him out of bounds, BTW), what should the call be? And penalties?

Sorry, I just saw the airborne passer thread - I'll check that for similarities.
Doesn't change anything. As I said, you can't do both; score the basket and call a team control foul.

If you score the basket, it means the shot was out of his hand before the foul occurred, so the foul can't be a team control foul, as there would be no team control.

If you call it a team control foul, then the ball has to still be in his hand.

One or the other, not both.
__________________
"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott

"You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Oct 23, 2006, 08:55am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 43
Seems to me that the foul would have to occur first if the foul was a continuation of his driving motion. Not enough time to catch and dunk before contact unless the defender was 6 feet away from driving A1. No Basket.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon Oct 23, 2006, 09:17am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 944
Got it. Thanks to all.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
The Big "X"... And It Counts!!! isneths Basketball 11 Wed Jul 14, 2004 04:35am
PC counts toward bonus? Cyber-Ref Basketball 2 Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:45am
counts? Troward Basketball 12 Fri Nov 22, 2002 05:32pm
visible counts Matt S. Basketball 14 Wed Nov 15, 2000 01:07pm
visual counts g-man Basketball 5 Fri Feb 04, 2000 10:16pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:58am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1