Race card played

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by REFVA

As I've been reading this thread, all of you are passionate about this topic make lot's of sense. let's keep in mind we all have our own interprtation and opinions. Let's also keep in mind that when this occurred, Was The assistance coach a possible parent or an adult that is not normally in the capacity of a coach. So he may have not had the proper training and does not know how to handle the game situation. might be (a coach wanna be) Doesn't make it right. As a ref we should be prepared to hear and recieve all kinds of abuse thrown at us. Including racial remarks.

Sorry but that's complete and total bull$hit. It makes no difference whether he makes his living as a coach or not. He's an asst. coach tonight. Further, I expect to hear stupid things from fans, coaches and players. But no official should have to tolerate profane, vulgar, or racist comments directed toward them.

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

Calling someone a bigot is not racism. If you are calling the coach a racist, does that make you a racist? Use some common sense here.

How 'bout you use little commone sense? No one said that it "makes him a racist." But it's definitely a racist comment from the coach. He used the word "bigot" to say that the official was cheating his team because they were of a different skin color. That's damn sure a racist remark.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

How 'bout you use little commone sense? No one said that it "makes him a racist." But it's definitely a racist comment from the coach. He used the word "bigot" to say that the official was cheating his team because they were of a different skin color. That's damn sure a racist remark.

Just for the record, I can't thing of any other way that calling someone a "bigot" under the particular circumstances described in the original post could not be racial in nature.

Jimgolf, What do you think that the assistant coach was actually trying to say- that the ref was bigoted against all assistant coaches?

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

How 'bout you use little commone sense? No one said that it "makes him a racist." But it's definitely a racist comment from the coach. He used the word "bigot" to say that the official was cheating his team because they were of a different skin color. That's damn sure a racist remark.

You're saying the coach made a racial remark. That is the same as the coach saying the official is a bigot. You are calling the coach a bigot, just using different words.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

You're saying the coach made a racial remark. That is the same as the coach saying the official is a bigot. You are calling the coach a bigot, just using different words.

I'm not saying anything to the asst. coach. I wasn't even there, so how can I be saying the coach is anything. I'm simply interpreting the meaning of his statement. You seem to be hung up on labeling people. I'm not labeling anyone here. I'm not a bigot, just because I view his comments as racial. The asst. coach may or may not be a bigot. It's not my responsibility to make that determinstaion. I'm discussing and judging his actions. I can certainly make a judgment that he made a racist statement. You said it yourself. The coach accused the official of cheating his team. Why? Because they were a different color.

You can side step it all day long but at the end of the day, if it walk like a duck, quacks like a duck and looks like a duck, it's a duck.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

You're saying the coach made a racial remark. That is the same as the coach saying the official is a bigot. You are calling the coach a bigot, just using different words.

Um, Jim, that's exactly what the coach said- that Larry was a bigot. I'm kinda missing whatever point that you're trying to make with that statement. And, yeah, if a person is making bigoted statements, then there's usually a pretty good chance that that person actually is a bigot. That's kinda irrelevant anyway though because the coach got thrown for making a racial comment, not for what he might be. Iow, he was penalized solely for his actions, and rightfully so imo.

[REFVA]

You would allow players and coaches to address you, your partners or the opponents in such a manner, just because outcome has been determined?BSKBLLREF

After the outcome has been determined and I'm out of the confinds of the gym, my status as an official is done. It's no diiferent if you came up to me in a public area and did the same thing. You are entitled to your opinion..
If you read my post, I said that during the game I will not tolerate it..

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by REFVA

After the outcome has been determined and I'm out of the confinds of the gym, my status as an official is done. It's no diiferent if you came up to me in a public area and did the same thing. You are entitled to your opinion..
If you read my post, I said that during the game I will not tolerate it..

So after the game, a coach or player comes into your locker room or sees you in the parking lot and makes a racial, profane or vulgar slur at you, you'll just accept that as him being entitled to his opinion?

Sorry but I don't think so. People have to be held accountable, when they're in such a position. We'll just agree to disagree on that one, partner.

[REFVA]

So after the game, a coach or player comes into your locker room or sees you in the parking lot and makes a racial, profane or vulgar slur at you, you'll just accept that as him being entitled to his opinion?
BKtBALLref

I reverse the question, what do you do if I came up to you as a stranger in public area and say the same racial remark?

There are step at scalastic level to report that coach and player and beyond that what other steps would you take?

[JugglingReferee]

From dictionary.com:

Bigot:

n.

One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.

I doubt the coaches/refs exchanged political or religious views. He could be referring to his group of players. I doubt it though.

Seems to me that race is the factor.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by REFVA

I reverse the question, what do you do if I came up to you as a stranger in public area and say the same racial remark?

You mean aside from punching you in the face?

I'm not addressing your comments as Joe Q. Public. I'm addressing your comments based on the fact that you are an official until you leave the grounds of a school. Your capacity doesn't end when the horn sounds. You are still a representative of your local association and your state association.

There are step at scalastic level to report that coach and player and beyond that what other steps would you take?

I don't know what scalastic is. But I do know that whether the game is over or not, I am still an official until I leave the grounds of that school. Coaches and players are accountable to the school, the local school board and the state asscoiation. The school is accountable for the conduct of fans on their premises. Even if it were a fan that approached me in the parking lot and directed racial, profane or vulgar language at me, damn skippy I would report the incident. It's more appropriate for me to approach someone in such a manner than it is for them to approach me.

I don't stop being an official just because the game is over.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Um, Jim, that's exactly what the coach said- that Larry was a bigot. I'm kinda missing whatever point that you're trying to make with that statement. And, yeah, if a person is making bigoted statements, then there's usually a pretty good chance that that person actually is a bigot. That's kinda irrelevant anyway though because the coach got thrown for making a racial comment, not for what he might be. Iow, he was penalized solely for his actions, and rightfully so imo.

I'm saying the Asst Coach calling the official a bigot doesn't mean the Asst Coach is a racist or a bigot. It just means he has a big mouth. He may have any number of motivations for saying that other than his own personal bigotry.

Calling someone a bigot doesn't make you a bigot. If it does, then you're a bigot, because you just called the coach a bigot. And I guess I'm a bigot because I just called you a bigot.

This is circular reasoning.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

I'm saying the Asst Coach calling the official a bigot doesn't mean the Asst Coach is a racist or a bigot. It just means he has a big mouth. He may have any number of motivations for saying that other than his own personal bigotry.

Calling someone a bigot doesn't make you a bigot. If it does, then you're a bigot, because you just called the coach a bigot. And I guess I'm a bigot because I just called you a bigot.

This is circular reasoning.

Yeah, Jim, the assistant coach might really be the nicest guy in the world, but again, that's completely and totally irrelevant. We penalize participants in a game for what they do, not for what they are. The assistant coach made an obvious racial comment imo; also imo, he deserved to be tossed for making that racial comment. Others may certainly disagree; that is their right also.

That's linear reasoning.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

I'm saying the Asst Coach calling the official a bigot doesn't mean the Asst Coach is a racist or a bigot. It just means he has a big mouth. He may have any number of motivations for saying that other than his own personal bigotry.

Calling someone a bigot doesn't make you a bigot. If it does, then you're a bigot, because you just called the coach a bigot. And I guess I'm a bigot because I just called you a bigot.

This is circular reasoning.

Again, it doesn't make any difference whether the guy is a bigot or not. No one is saying he is or isn't. THAT HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. It's a racist remark, based on the reason he called him a bigot.

[Jimgolf]

Originally Posted by BktBallRef

Again, it doesn't make any difference whether the guy is a bigot or not. No one is saying he is or isn't. THAT HAS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. It's a racist remark, based on the reason he called him a bigot.

You are missing my point entirely. Calling someone a bigot is not necessarily, in and of itself a racist remark.

It may even be a true remark.

It may be a stupid remark, in that the person saying it might be misinterpreting events.

It may be the sign of someone having a chip on their shoulder.

It may even actually be a racist remark.

Think about it. If you call Archie Bunker a bigot, is that a racist remark?

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Jimgolf

You are missing my point entirely. Calling someone a bigot is not necessarily, in and of itself a racist remark.

It may even be a true remark.

I suppose it doesn't matter whether it's true or not, racist or not. It's unsportsmanlike to say it, and deserves a T, just like saying "You're the worst ref I've ever seen". Automatic whack, regardless of looking at the coach's schedule to see who worked there last week or the week before.