Is sub allowed? or not?

[Overnbach]

New member here. I registered just to ask this question.

As the scoreboard operator, is it my responsibility to inform officials when a player reports after the first horn? Frequently, between quarters or during a time out, in the general confusion in front of the table, a substitute will report after the horn, and then just go out on the floor with the rest of the team, and the officials on the floor either don't notice or don't enforce the rule.

[jkjenning]

Originally posted by Overnbach
As the scoreboard operator, is it my responsibility to inform officials when a player reports after the first horn?

Hello Overnbach! In reading rules 2-11 [Scorer's Duties] and 2-12 [Timer's Duties] I don't see any reference to this as one of your duties/responsibilites. I think the officials may ask for your help in this, but by rule it seems to me that this is clearly an officials' responsibility. I would say that if the officiating crew shows concern that you help them out with this, then by all means do so - otherwise, let the crew observe for themselves and decide whether a substitute is legal.

[BktBallRef]

Originally Posted by jkjenning

Hello Overnbach! In reading rules 2-11 [Scorer's Duties] and 2-12 [Timer's Duties] I don't see any reference to this as one of your duties/responsibilites. I think the officials may ask for your help in this, but by rule it seems to me that this is clearly an officials' responsibility. I would say that if the officiating crew shows concern that you help them out with this, then by all means do so - otherwise, let the crew observe for themselves and decide whether a substitute is legal.

Not true.

2-11-2
The scorer shall:
Notify the nearer official when there is an infraction of the rules pertaining to submission of the roster, substitutions or numbers of players.

It's up to the scorer to notify the nearest official if a player attempts to enter the game:
without reporting.
if he has reported after the warning horn sounds.
after being disqualified.
after being subbed for but before time expires on the clock.

[jkjenning]

Thanks for the correction, BktBallRef!! I need to parse the words more thoughtfully, it appears.

Perhaps you will answer a related question? In browsing basketball camps for this summer, I notice that all of them, so far, have contained disclaimers similar to "this is not intended to be a rules clinic", meaning the focus will be on evaluating mechanics, etc. So that disclaimer begs the question: "are there clinics specifically devoted to the rules?" I know our local association has them, but they are generally focused on rule revisions rather than a "systematic study of the rules".

[BktBallRef]

Most camps are going on the assumnption that you have a working knowledge of the rules. Camps are designed to help you understand how to offiicate the game. Mechanics, game management, positioning, philosophy are all part of the camp experience. As a "truerookie," I thought I knew how to officiate. My first realization that I didn't really know how to officiate was my first camp, a Dale Kelley camp that I went to 16 years ago. What an eye opening experience!

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by jkjenning

"are there clinics specifically devoted to the rules?"

I agree with Tony on this. I don't know of any camps where they spend much time at all teaching rules. In fact, at one camp that I attend, on the first day, the instructor stands up and asks, "Who can tell me what a multiple foul is?" God help the poor guy who raises his hand. The instructor then takes a rulebook and throws it in the trash. "Anybody can memorize that. We're going to teach you how to officiate."

That's pretty much the mentality of every camp I've been to.