three fouls, two whistles

[BktBallRef]

Originally posted by dhodges007
I was told at basketball camp that is one of the dumbest calls!! Something had to happen first. There are very few times where you want to call a double foul.

Don't believe everything they tell you at camp. Double fouls do occur. I don't think anyone here would disagree that there are very few times that you would want to call one, but they do occur.

[Tim Roden]

I concur that there is a place for the double foul. Why did the NCAA have one in there POE film about four years ago? The key to being a good official is knowing when to use it. It should be very sparingly and only when there NEEDS to be a stopage of play but not a penalty given.

The last double foul I remember calling, I did get a film of the game and in it I saw that the action was instigated by one of the two players. It should have been a single foul but from where I was on the floor I couldn't see that the way the camera could, 20' above the floor.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by dhodges007

I was told at basketball camp that is one of the dumbest calls!! Something had to happen first. There are very few times where you want to call a double foul.

There may be very few times when *you* might want to call
it, but as I already said it's an effective tool that I
have never had trouble with.

[mick]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

There may be very few times when *you* might want to call
it, but as I already said it's an effective tool that I
have never had trouble with.

Dan,
I'm with you all the way.
Use as needed.
mick

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

I am going to address this play as if it were a rules test question and not get into a discussion about how to handle it during a real game because that is a whole different ballgame. I do believe that as a rules test question it serves as a good example for knowing our definitions.

A1 drives to the basket and shoots the ball while airborne. A1 then continues on in the air and makes illegal contact with B1 who had a legal position on the floor prior to A1 going airborne. A1's contact with B1 is a common foul under NFHS/NCAA rules. The ball does not necessarily become dead because of the A1's foul. The double foul by A2 and B2 does not complicate this play because the double foul was committed before the common foul by A1.

Under NFHS/NCAA rules this play is a false double foul. The double foul by A2 and B2 is the first foul in the play. The common foul by A1 against B1 is the second foul in the play. When a false double foul occurs, they are penalized in the order that they occurs, and the ball is put into play as if the last foul in the false double foul is the only foul that occurs.

Since the common foul by A1 is the last foul in the false double foul, we put the ball into play for that foul only.

Under NFHS/NCAA Women's rules, A1's foul is a player control foul, the ball became dead immediately. If the ball went through the basket, no score would count. Team B would get the ball out of bounds along the end line under Team A's basket for a designated spot throw-in.

Under NCAA Men's rules the ball does not become dead immediately. If the ball went through the basket, Team A would be created with a field goal. If Team B is in the bonus, B1 would go to the line for free throws. If Team B is not in the bonus, Team B would get the ball out of bounds along the end line under Team A's basket for a designated spot throw-in.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

I apologize for my last posting because I did not read the play correctly. I thought that A1 made contact while still in the air on a drive to the basket. Oh well that is a good casebook play anyway. I guess I was having one of those senior moments that people of my age start to get.

[Dan_ref]

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
I apologize for my last posting because I did not read the play correctly. I thought that A1 made contact while still in the air on a drive to the basket. Oh well that is a good casebook play anyway. I guess I was having one of those senior moments that people of my age start to get.

I would like to welcome you to the Three Second Attention
Span Club. Here's your ID card, notice your serial number
is "2". All are welcome, except Mick.

[mick]

Originally posted by Dan_ref

I would like to welcome you to the Three Second Attention
Span Club. Here's your ID card, notice your serial number
is "2". All are welcome, except Mick.

I thought I was a flounding flounder.

[rainmaker]

Originally posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.
I apologize for my last posting because I did not read the play correctly. I thought that A1 made contact while still in the air on a drive to the basket. Oh well that is a good casebook play anyway. I guess I was having one of those senior moments that people of my age start to get.

I'll forgive you this senior moment, if you'll forgive me this question if it seems strange:

In your original post, you have two different rules references, one for NFHS/NCAA and one for NFHS/NCAA Women's. In the first, reference you call it a common foul, and in the second, PC. But I thought that under NFHS, this is PC for both boys and girls. Am I misunderstanding your references?

[mick]

Originally posted by rainmaker

I'll forgive you this senior moment, if you'll forgive me this question if it seems strange:

In your original post, you have two different rules references, one for NFHS/NCAA and one for NFHS/NCAA Women's. In the first, reference you call it a common foul, and in the second, PC. But I thought that under NFHS, this is PC for both boys and girls. Am I misunderstanding your references?

Jewel,
In the back of your NFHS Rule Book (pg.82-83), NFHS shows a relationship to High School, Women, Men.
Three different games in some places.
mick

[twoblindrefs]

I can't imagine a player in a men's league being unhappy...aren't they just playing for recreation....?

[Mark Padgett]

Originally posted by twoblindrefs
I can't imagine a player in a men's league being unhappy...aren't they just playing for recreation....?

I understand your sarcasm and appreciate it. Around here, the rule in men's leagues (at least, based on the reaction of the players when a foul is called on them) is - no reconstructive surgery, no foul.

BTW - we refer to men's leagues as "jerkball."