Lag Time

[johnnyrao]

I need some help with the interpretation of the lag time principle.

Here is the situation: You blow the whistle for an out of bounds call very close to the expiration of time. You look at the clock and see (without a doubt) there are 1.7 seconds. You watch as the clock winds down and it finally stops at 0.3 secs.

Can you put back on the entire time and go to 1.7 secs since you have definite knowledge there was 1.7 on the clock when you blew the whistle or do you go to 0.7 secs, taking into account the 1 second lag time principle.

Also, am I correct in thinking that if the clock had stopped at 0.7 secs or more you cannot put any time back on the clock since the lag time principle would then apply?

Thanks.

RAO

[rainmaker]

I just love getting in the first post, but I don't feel very confident about these rules, so I'll leave them to someone else!

[Grail]

You would restore the time back to 1.7 seconds. Lag time is "permissible", but it is not guaranteed. Basically, as long as the timer stops the clock within 1 second all is good, if not correct to perfection (or as close as you can get).

[brainbrian]

A nice word like "let's keep on our toes" or "let's try and stay awake now" to the timer probably wouldn't be a bad idea either.

[Mark Dexter]

The lag time rule, as currently written, allows you to make corrections when more than 1 second has elapsed from the time when the clock was supposed to be stopped. When such a correction is made, it is made back to the point where the clock should have stopped.

[mplagrow]

Wow, you're a better man than I if you can discern that clock time to the nearest 10th of a second when you're blowing the whistle!

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by mplagrow
Wow, you're a better man than I if you can discern that clock time to the nearest 10th of a second when you're blowing the whistle!

It's something at which you can work on getting better. (I like to think that I have an inherent advantage from doing the clock/book for so long.) Next time you watch an NBA/NCAA game that actually shows a picture of the clock (instead of the CGI stuff) just pay attention in the last minute of each half/quarter. With practice, you'll be able to distinguish between all the digits when the whistle blows.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by Mark Dexter

It's something at which you can work on getting better. (I like to think that I have an inherent advantage from doing the clock/book for so long.) Next time you watch an NBA/NCAA game that actually shows a picture of the clock (instead of the CGI stuff) just pay attention in the last minute of each half/quarter. With practice, you'll be able to distinguish between all the digits when the whistle blows.

The CGI stuff (actually called "CG" stuff by the industry) would work just fine. You don't need to know the game clock time to which an event occured, just the time on any clock with tenths of a second.

[Nevadaref]

The following play is from last season's interps and is posted on the NFHS website. It provides the best guidance for the lag time rule that the FED has given. However, it does not have an example for a clock displaying tenths of a second. What others have told you is correct though. If MORE than 1 second comes off, then you put all of it back. If the timer takes 1 second or less to stop the clock, then you have to leave it where it is.


SITUATION 8: As the official calls a traveling violation, he/she properly sounds the whistle and gives the signal to stop the clock. While doing this, the official is able to see the exact time remaining in the fourth quarter. The clock shows 55 seconds remaining. The timer stops the clock: (a) at 55 seconds; (b) at 54 seconds; (c) at 53 seconds; or (d) 50 seconds. RULING: In (a) and (b), there has been no obvious timing mistake. The timer should be able to react and stop the clock in one second when the whistle is heard and/or the signal is seen. However, in (c) and (d), more than one second of time elapsed from the time the signal was given until the clock was stopped. The referee will order 55 seconds put on the clock in (c) and (d). COMMENT: By interpretation, “lag or reaction” time is limited to one second when the official’s signal is heard and/or seen clearly. The rules do not permit the referee to correct situations resulting in normal reaction time of the timer which results in a “lag” in stopping the clock. Additional time which may subsequently run off the clock (after the one second lag time) is considered a timing mistake and may be corrected. (5-10-1)

[socalreff]

What about NCAA rules? Does lag time still exist, or do you put the correct time up no matter what?

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by JugglingReferee

The CGI stuff (actually called "CG" stuff by the industry) would work just fine. You don't need to know the game clock time to which an event occured, just the time on any clock with tenths of a second.

True, although I find that the graphic displays often leave quite a bit to be desired.

[JugglingReferee]

Originally posted by Mark Dexter

True, although I find that the graphic displays often leave quite a bit to be desired.

I may have a biased opinion, since my day job is to develop those CG systems.

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by JugglingReferee

I may have a biased opinion, since my day job is to develop those CG systems.

And I'm sure yours are among the better systems.

[johnnyrao]

Originally posted by mplagrow
Wow, you're a better man than I if you can discern that clock time to the nearest 10th of a second when you're blowing the whistle!

Actually, the fact that I actually looked at the clock when I blew the whistle is not a common occurrence for me. Maybe that's what generated my question. Hopefully I can continue this trend in the future.

[Daryl H. Long]

In addition to the play cited by Nevadaref there is a similar play in the Case book. 5.10.1 Situation D on page 41.

NF is correct in their ruling in both these cases only in parts (a), (c), and (d).

NF is WRONG in part (b).

WHY? Read the COMMENT on page 41 of the NF Case Book following 5.10.1 Situation B. The last sentence reads, "One second or the "reaction" time is interpreted to have elapsed (past tense) from the time the signal (whistle) was made until the official glanced at the clock.
This means that the time the the official actually sees already includes the one second allowable 'lag' time. The timer should be able to react to the whisle and stop the clock at that time also. Anything less is a timer's mistake.

The NF ruling in Part (b) of both cases applies lag time twice. The correct ruling in all parts should be to reset the clock to the exact time seen by the official after sounding his whistle.

More specifically: NF Website Situation 8, in all cases (a-d) the official should reset the clock to 55 seconds.

In Case 5.10.1 Situation D, in all cases (a-d) the official should reset the clock to 5 seconds.