Foul Language

[tomegun]

Rut, I don't even know what to say to you.

You are well spoken and you have your own opinions.

Strong opinions.

On this subject, like others I have remained silent on in the past, your opinions are as ignorant as hell but they are your opinions.

I'm sorry moderators/posters but for this guy to casually throw out the race card when it doesn't exist and then ignore this just because both players are black doesn't make any sense to me.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by tomegun
Rut, I don't even know what to say to you.

You are well spoken and you have your own opinions.

Strong opinions.

On this subject, like others I have remained silent on in the past, your opinions are as ignorant as hell but they are your opinions.

I'm sorry moderators/posters but for this guy to casually throw out the race card when it doesn't exist and then ignore this just because both players are black doesn't make any sense to me.

In my opinion your point of view is not only stupid, but shortsighted and not much of my concern. Do what you like. I will definitely do what I like and feel. Especially when someone thinks race is a card that someone plays. That tells me everything I need to know about you.

I also did not say that that a single word used by people of the same race was to just be ignored or accepted. That just shows how much you either did not read my response or you are so emotional about the issue, you cannot see that everyone on this planet agrees with you. Maybe you have just been in Nevada too long. Who knows or who cares at this point.

Have a great evening.

Peace

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by JRutledge


I just have found out that this is not the place to have those kinds of discussions about race. If your only interaction with folks outside of your race is on this site and in the game of basketball, then maybe you need to find some acquaintances to have these discussions with. I am not going to be that person anymore.

Peace OUT!!!

I thought you weren't gonna be the person to have these discussions here anymore...but 5 posts later...

[JRutledge]

Actually Rocky, these were my exact words below. Then again, the actual words never seem to be something that most people want to actually confront. Let us just assume something was said and keep repeating it. Maybe it will eventually come true.

Originally posted by JRutledge
I really do not see the point of having this deep conversation.

Originally posted by JRutledge
I just have found out that this is not the place to have those kinds of discussions about race.

Peace

[tomegun]

I don't know what my being in Nevada has to do with anything but whatever you say. I have been in the DC area for almost 2 years, does that matter?

Something like this happened to another official I know and she asked what I thought about it. I also asked several of my friends. Nobody said anything less than a T was in order. These were girls and the girl who said it was the best in the state of Nevada.

You are the master at deflecting things after you put your foot in your mouth with a stupid comment. The point of the matter is you show your ignorance all the time. The player in this play taunted and used a word that is a racial slur no matter what color they are. That is two reasons to give a T. If you choose to ignore both of those things then thank you for letting everyone know what kind of official you are. I know you will say things like you don't come here for validation and the people who work with you respect you and all that crap. If you have so much respect from them why do you even come here when virtually every thread you give your opinion on turns into a bad thing. Sure, you can do what you want in your area but why is it always you against everyone else?

As a black man I'm embarassed about your comments regarding this subject. I'm from the midwest and I've spent considerable time in the south, west and east. I would expect anyone I know across the USA to administer a T for this act. You are an embarassment in Illinois, Nevada, DC or anywhere else for even suggesting you wouldn't do the right thing.

Now I'm done with this thread for real!

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally posted by JRutledge

Why are you not asking those that live in your area?

I most certainly have discussed this with people in my area. Not just referees, but the people we referees have to deal with-- leagues, coaches, administrators, etc. With regard to any type of epithet related to race, religion, color, creed, etc., we have a "zero tolerance" policy. Nobody gets a pass, no matter if they claim that they were only kidding when they used an epithet.

Does this policy eliminate incidents? Hell no. Hopefully it reduces them though. We realize that we can't change how any person really thinks or what they are. That doesn't mean that we or others have to put up with them in an an enviroment that we, as officials, are supposed to be responsible for.

No need to respond. We disagree and we're just going around in circles now anyway.

[JRutledge]

Originally posted by tomegun
I don't know what my being in Nevada has to do with anything but whatever you say. I have been in the DC area for almost 2 years, does that matter?

Something like this happened to another official I know and she asked what I thought about it. I also asked several of my friends. Nobody said anything less than a T was in order. These were girls and the girl who said it was the best in the state of Nevada.

You are the master at deflecting things after you put your foot in your mouth with a stupid comment. The point of the matter is you show your ignorance all the time. The player in this play taunted and used a word that is a racial slur no matter what color they are. That is two reasons to give a T. If you choose to ignore both of those things then thank you for letting everyone know what kind of official you are. I know you will say things like you don't come here for validation and the people who work with you respect you and all that crap. If you have so much respect from them why do you even come here when virtually every thread you give your opinion on turns into a bad thing. Sure, you can do what you want in your area but why is it always you against everyone else?

As a black man I'm embarassed about your comments regarding this subject. I'm from the midwest and I've spent considerable time in the south, west and east. I would expect anyone I know across the USA to administer a T for this act. You are an embarassment in Illinois, Nevada, DC or anywhere else for even suggesting you wouldn't do the right thing.

Now I'm done with this thread for real!

You are the one that should be embarrassed by your actions but you words. I do not know what they do in Nevada, but it seems like you need to go somewhere that you can expose yourself to other people of color. You obviously are not getting that in Nevada.

Originally posted by theboys


Since both players were black, I thought the referee handled the situation appropriately, but it sure made you think about cultural differences, and what constitutes crossing the line.

Originally posted by theboys
I hear more cursing or bad language in baseball games where 99% of the players are white and come from very affluent backgrounds or communities. If I threw out every white baseball player that used some foul language, I would have 2 or 3 ejections every game. So do not give me that only inner city kids of color are the ones cursing and subject to bad behavior. That is much more cursing than I ever hear working a basketball game with kids from many different races and cultures. I think you need to get a clue.

Peace

Where in my post did I say anything about the usage of the "N" word or condoning racial comments of any kind? I simply said that Black kids are not inherent for inappropriate comments or language that might be offensive. It sounded to me from the boys statement that inner-city kids were the only ones subject to comments that were outside the bounds of appropriateness. And when inner-city kids say things, they should be looked in a different light as the white suburbanites that play the game. That was the only part of this discussion that I commented on. That was the only part I took any exception to. But no, you and JR and even Chuck ran with this comment and assumed I was condoning the usage of a word which I never addressed in this thread. You should not be an assumption that one thing is acceptable in the "hood" and something else is acceptable in the suburbs. When you got on your little tangent about "I do not care what Rut says," with Chuck, it was obvious to me you never once really read my comments or tried to understand my comments.

There is a book that has been out for a couple of years call "N@@@@r, The Strange Career of a Troublesome Word." The book deals with the very word and its usage, acceptance, non-acceptance and history. Now I do not agree with the premise of the author Randall Kennedy (who I believe teaches at an Ivy League school) and his position that the words "sting" is gone. I have major problems with that position. I do understand that there is a movement that is against the position that both you and I hold. But the way I want to handle a situation on a basketball court is different than the way you want to handle a situation on court.

You are a complete sorry *** person if you think everyone in this country regardless of education and background should feel the way you do. First of all they do not. Listen to todayÂ’s culture, music and theater. I do not know what they do in Nevada, but there are a whole lot of things dealing with issues like that here that are not in other cities or other parts of the country. I grew up in a small, rural college town. The college I went to most of the students were from Chicago and there were students both Black and white that never interacted with others outside of their race until they reached college. How those kids act on a basketball court is a reflection of their personal experiences and what is appropriate and what is not appropriate is shaped by what they learned from others.

I had two situations this year with Black kids using this word during games toward their own teammates (not used as a put down). One time it was a football game, another time it was a college basketball game. Both times I made a point to say something and literally got in the face of the kids. In the football game the team was all-Black and I addressed the entire defensive unit when two kids used that word. When I was finished, I did not hear that word again the rest of the game, but a couple of kids where saying "Amen" to my comments. This particular game was between two all-Black schools. The visiting team had a mostly white coaching staff and it was one of their players that used that word. The home team that had an entire African-American coaching staff, their players did not use such language. I was personally satisfied with the way I handled it and so were my fellow officials. I just wanted the action to not only stop, but the kids to realize where they were, who was watching and tell them it was not acceptable to me and many others around them. Throwing a flag would have done nothing but make the players think some official was picking on them. Then I would have to explain the issue to the coach. Then I might have had further problems in that game. Instead, I got their attention and respect for the rest of the game. And maybe, just maybe one of those kids remembers my comments and either change their behavior or they recognize they need to watch what they say around other people.

I have never heard one Black player use that word to another player. And if I did I might use a different approach. But even then there are Black kids that know each other and might say something to an opponent knowing it would be accepted. I will cross that bridge when I get to it.

All you did was jump to a conclusion that was further from the truth. I have been exposed to more things than most here or in this country. If you look at the library of my parents home and there are more books dealing with race and gender that you could not find all the books in a college library. I have a minor in African-American studies where this issue was discussed 10 times over in class and read many books I would have never been exposed to if I did not have that minor.

Thank you for giving all these great people a narrow view of what all of us is supposed to think.

Peace

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by JRutledge
Actually Rocky, these were my exact words below. Then again, the actual words never seem to be something that most people want to actually confront. Let us just assume something was said and keep repeating it. Maybe it will eventually come true.

I quoted your EXACT words from an earlier post...so the only one not confronting the words is you - you said you were going to stop and didn't...