I may have T record!

[tmp44]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

Correct, but this is by interp, isn't it? I don't think there's an article in Rule 10 that says "no more Ts", is there? I think I read this in mid-season bulletin.

I'm only a FED official so I don't know...but the no more T's after ejection, did this come after the Teddy Valenite/Bobby Knight incident where Teddy V gave Knight 3? And what is the reasoning behind this; i.e. if in NCAA you eject a coach and as he is going off the court he says the worse thing you have ever heard as an official, you can't penalize him again?

[Adam]

Originally posted by tmp44

I'm only a FED official so I don't know...but the no more T's after ejection, did this come after the Teddy Valenite/Bobby Knight incident where Teddy V gave Knight 3? And what is the reasoning behind this; i.e. if in NCAA you eject a coach and as he is going off the court he says the worse thing you have ever heard as an official, you can't penalize him again?

No, because he'll get a nice little fine from the conference, NCAA, or school. I'd say at this point, you've done your part.

[ChuckElias]

Originally posted by tmp44
the no more T's after ejection, did this come after the Teddy Valenite/Bobby Knight incident where Teddy V gave Knight 3?

I believe that's true. The newest change to the BI rule is also a direct result of that conflict. (Teddy called it correctly, BTW.)

And what is the reasoning behind this?

I think Kelvin gave an excellent explanation on the first page of the thread.

[imkcalls]

worked a D1 collage game where my R gave 6

[thumpferee]

Originally posted by imkcalls
worked a D1 collage game where my R gave 6

Not in less than 30 secs though! lol

Or did he?

[Junker]

I think Larry Eustachy got 5 in the NCAA loss to Michigan State in 2000.

[Mark Dexter]

Originally posted by ChuckElias

Correct, but this is by interp, isn't it? I don't think there's an article in Rule 10 that says "no more Ts", is there? I think I read this in mid-season bulletin.

Originally, yes - thanks, "Ted V." and "Bob K."

The 2004 book, however, states it clear as day - 10-2.2.

[LepTalBldgs]

In the quiet of my office (what work?), I gotta take exception to the direct T on the coach if circumstances were as you wrote it.

I've given out my share of T's, especially in rec ball. But there have been a few instances where I gave multiple T's too quickly.

In this last instance, after having given out two T's in a very short period (both warranted), my fast rec ball T's have taught me that I may be a little too hyper. In my case I have been too quick to issue multiple T's when the only person "offended" was me, and where other officials may have been more rational. My "ears" were up.

If everyone saw a dramatic gesture, and a gym-filling roar of "whatever", then maybe. But if it was a small thing, the game may be better off by letting it go.

Make them earn the last one. Just my humble opinion.

[Back In The Saddle]

I had a good official suggest to me that after calling a T, stick your fingers in your ears for 30 seconds. Then if the recipient is still going at it, bang him again.

What is the point of the T? I submit that it's really not to punish the offender, so much as it's to remedy the situation. If a coach goes off at me and I T him, and he takes another 10 seconds to vent, even vigorously, and then settles down, haven't I acheived my goal? I wouldn't say never give quick back-to-back Ts, but could the desired end be acheived without it?

[thumpferee]

Originally posted by Back In The Saddle
I had a good official suggest to me that after calling a T, stick your fingers in your ears for 30 seconds. Then if the recipient is still going at it, bang him again.

What is the point of the T? I submit that it's really not to punish the offender, so much as it's to remedy the situation. If a coach goes off at me and I T him, and he takes another 10 seconds to vent, even vigorously, and then settles down, haven't I acheived my goal? I wouldn't say never give quick back-to-back Ts, but could the desired end be acheived without it?

And where is your creditability as an official end? If you let the coach you just T'd up continue on his rampage, where do you draw the line with the other coach?

Hmmmm, Coach etc got away with it, let me try saying this...

Coaches coach, players play, officials do the rest.

IMO of course!

[ref18]

I think I may have a T record

Well you've got me beat

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally posted by thumpferee

And where is your creditability as an official end? If you let the coach you just T'd up continue on his rampage, where do you draw the line with the other coach?

Hmmmm, Coach etc got away with it, let me try saying this...

Coaches coach, players play, officials do the rest.

IMO of course!

If an official needs to be such an iron-fisted dictator that he dumps the coach if he doesn't shut up the instant he Ts him the first time, he probably don't have much credibility to lose. IMO of course!

It's always goint to be on a case-by-case basis, but generally you gain credibility by handling people calmly and even-handedly. If you can whack a coach who has crossed the line, let him make his point or get the last word or whatever it is he's trying to accomplish while getting him back to his bench, and then he settles down and goes back to work, you're credibility goes up. You won. He got the penalty he deserved, and you demonstrated that you're in control of the coach, the game and yourself.

What about the other coach? Well, he now knows for certain that you will whack someone who crosses the line. But he's also seen that you're not such a hothead that he has to live in fear of you.

Which is easier to deal with, a coach who will talk to you when he's got an issue, or a coach whose afraid of you and bottles up his issues until they boil over?

Now I haven't said never. If you whack a coach and he goes nuts and throws furniture, yeah he's gone. But even then, it's better for your partner to get him, not you.

[Stat-Man]

Here's my story for most number of T's.

In 1985 or 1986 (I forget the exact year, but it wa sone of those), my grade school would host a year end tournament for other area CYO 5th/6th grade squads.

During one particular game, a coach tellsa player to go in for somebody and the kid runs right onto the court at that moment. T#1. Coach argues witht he officials about the first T and ends up getting 4 more Ts before the officials let him know if he doesn't leave the gym, the game ends. It's the only time in 21 years I've seen a single coach get 5 Ts and I hope it's the last time.