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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 11:59am
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Question

My first year officiating was last season. I've been reviwing my performance since then, going over the good, bad and otherwise. I came up with a question about how I handled a bad call from my partner.

This was a Jr High Girls game. Team A was shooting, rebounding, shooting, rebounding, all "in the paint", maybe 4 times. I'm lead. Trail blows whistle, and indicates "3 Seconds"!!

Ball goes the other way, then OB right next to the coach the call went against. As we set up to inbound, she says to me with frustration, "You can't call 3 seconds when we are shooting!" My response was, "I know. I know." She says to let partner know that at the half.

Is this OK? Part of me says I should have directed her to my partner, to let him admit he blew it. Or am I missing something else?

Please advise.

JH
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 12:20pm
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Harsty, you are allowed to say nothing.

Sometimes it's the best course.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 12:23pm
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That is why these are learning experiences.

I would not worry about it, it was a JH game. Now some will try to say that all games are important and they are. But this is where mistakes are made, so I would not get down on yourself. I am sure your partner was newer or not very good, that is why they are there most of the time.

I just would have said, "I am not sure when the call the 3 seconds, before the shot or after." Then go to your partner and ask them directly what they had? Maybe they called it before the shots and were made. Or just maybe they had a brain fart and screwed up. It is just one call in the game, not the end of the world.

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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 12:27pm
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Working with bad refs can be a good thing. It puts you in tough situations like this so that when it happens in the Final Four, you'll know exactly what to do.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 12:28pm
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I probably would agree w/Dan to say either nothing or say to the coach that you would talk w/your partner to see what he had.

When you do make sure your partner understands that 3 seconds starts over when a shot goes up.

Dealing w/coaches and partners comes over time. It is a learned trait, but don't let it bother you, especially if that was the worst thing that happend to you in your first year.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 12:57pm
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I lean towards acknowledging the coach.

When the coach makes what is an absolutely true statement (in a polite manner) and is looking for a response and you don't acknowledge it, it only hurts us. Coaches want communication. They only get more agitated if they're ignored.

If your partner got it wrong and everyone (except perhaps him) knows it, there's no reason to cover it up when asked. Your partner put you in that position by not knowing the rules. It's not like judgement where we should back up our partner.

I'd answer the coach, "Yes, you're right. I can't change his call, well discuss it at half-time".

However, if it is not brought up by the coach, I wouldn't bring it up.

It most definitely needs to be discussed at halftime/postgame in hopes that the partner will not propagate his ignorance.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 12:58pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by lrpalmer3
Working with bad refs can be a good thing. It puts you in tough situations like this so that when it happens in the Final Four, you'll know exactly what to do.
Luther, there's a big difference between a "bad" ref and an "inexperienced' ref. Bad refs usually don't get any better; inexperienced refs usually do. One bad call does not a "bad" ref make. Yes, the official was wrong. Hopefully, someone ended up pointing that out to him so that he didn't make the same mistake again.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 01:15pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust
I lean towards acknowledging the coach.

When the coach makes what is an absolutely true statement (in a polite manner) and is looking for a response and you don't acknowledge it, it only hurts us. Coaches want communication. They only get more agitated if they're ignored.

If your partner got it wrong and everyone (except perhaps him) knows it, there's no reason to cover it up when asked. Your partner put you in that position by not knowing the rules. It's not like judgement where we should back up our partner.

I'd answer the coach, "Yes, you're right. I can't change his call, well discuss it at half-time".

However, if it is not brought up by the coach, I wouldn't bring it up.

It most definitely needs to be discussed at halftime/postgame in hopes that the partner will not propagate his ignorance.
Official: "Yes, you're right. I can't change his call, well discuss it at half-time".

Coach: "WHAT!!!!??? WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU CAN'T CHANGE THE CALL???!!! IF IT'S WRONG THEN FIX IT!!!! FIRST HE SCREWS ME AND NOW YOU SCREW ME!!!!!!"

Hardly seems worth the effort.




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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 01:17pm
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The bottom line.

No matter what you do, learn from it. There is not always a right and a wrong here. Sometimes slience is golden. Other times you have to say something. I think a lot of this would depend on where I was and what tone the coach was taking with me.

Believe me, you will have many more situations like this if you continue to officiate. Just learn from them and move on.

Peace
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 01:30pm
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I actually would go with Dan on this call, I'm not going to say anything to the coach and at the next chance talk to my partner about the miscall.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 01:37pm
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I've used this little phrase to a lot of coaches in a lot of different situations and it seems to work pretty well. I think it might apply to your sitch standing next to the coach when in-bounding a ball.

Just let her talk, and when she's done say, "I hear you, coach. Thank you." There's not much more that needs to be said.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 01:40pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust


If your partner got it wrong and everyone (except perhaps him) knows it, there's no reason to cover it up when asked. Your partner put you in that position by not knowing the rules. It's not like judgement where we should back up our partner.

I'd answer the coach, "Yes, you're right. I can't change his call, well discuss it at half-time".

Oh,my. That's called "hanging your partner out to dry" imo. I would never, ever say that to a coach. As soon as you say that, your partner just lost all of his credibility for the rest of that game, and maybe even longer in that coach's eyes. I might, under some circumstances, admit to a coach that I might have missed a call, but I'm never going to tell a coach that one of my partners blew one. I'll leave that up to my partner.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 01:53pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust


If your partner got it wrong and everyone (except perhaps him) knows it, there's no reason to cover it up when asked. Your partner put you in that position by not knowing the rules. It's not like judgement where we should back up our partner.

I'd answer the coach, "Yes, you're right. I can't change his call, well discuss it at half-time".

Oh,my. That's called "hanging your partner out to dry" imo. I would never, ever say that to a coach. As soon as you say that, your partner just lost all of his credibility for the rest of that game, and maybe even longer in that coach's eyes. I might, under some circumstances, admit to a coach that I might have missed a call, but I'm never going to tell a coach that one of my partners blew one. I'll leave that up to my partner.
I agree, you can't undermind your partner like that, its okay to admit to your own mistakes but to do that to your partner isn't right.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 02:58pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by Snake~eyes
Quote:
Originally posted by Jurassic Referee
Quote:
Originally posted by Camron Rust


If your partner got it wrong and everyone (except perhaps him) knows it, there's no reason to cover it up when asked. Your partner put you in that position by not knowing the rules. It's not like judgement where we should back up our partner.

I'd answer the coach, "Yes, you're right. I can't change his call, well discuss it at half-time".

Oh,my. That's called "hanging your partner out to dry" imo. I would never, ever say that to a coach. As soon as you say that, your partner just lost all of his credibility for the rest of that game, and maybe even longer in that coach's eyes. I might, under some circumstances, admit to a coach that I might have missed a call, but I'm never going to tell a coach that one of my partners blew one. I'll leave that up to my partner.
I agree, you can't undermind your partner like that, its okay to admit to your own mistakes but to do that to your partner isn't right.
This is why my response is so appropriate. It doesn't admit anything, either yes, or no. It just acknowledges that the coach has expressed an opinion and that it will be considered. It's really very useful. If you look the coach in the eye, give a sort of pleasant half-smile and keep your tone of voice very neutral, it just shuts down everything. And can't be quoted in the newspaper.
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Old Thu Jul 22, 2004, 03:13pm
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Quote:
Originally posted by rainmaker
This is why my response is so appropriate. It doesn't admit anything, either yes, or no. It just acknowledges that the coach has expressed an opinion and that it will be considered. It's really very useful. If you look the coach in the eye, give a sort of pleasant half-smile and keep your tone of voice very neutral, it just shuts down everything. And can't be quoted in the newspaper. [/B]
Experienced coaches know how to expose an official's weaknesses. Him asking you about that call may be a test to see how "together" you and your partner are. If you hang your partner out to dry, now he knows that he can divide and conquer.

"I hear you coach." does wonders.
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