College Intramural Playoffs Begin Tonight

HoosierBuckeye Ref · #1 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2004, 04:57pm

To go along with another thread (First Time, Long Time), I have read this forum for at least three years or so before I finally decided that it was worth the FREE registration to ask questions and pose situations.

At any rate, this forum has helped me greatly with many different aspects of my basketball officiating and I hope that continues as I just passed my test this past December (read the profile for my other history).

I have yet to do a "real" game with my patch, but I think the opportunities will arise next school year.

My first question is here at Indiana University (NFHS rules), the intramural playoffs are starting tonight (yes, I know how many of you feel about intramurals, but I treat it as thought it is a real game with regards to my mechanics and everything that goes along with that, mainly so I can be ready for next school year) and would you have any suggestions as to things to watch out for that you may have seen in your high school games this season?

During the season I was very leanient in giving T's for jewelry if I saw it as the game was taking place. I just told them to take it off, but now I realize since it is playoff time and every team is fighting for the chance to play at Assembly Hall in the final game, I am abandoning this thinking, and also the liability issue is too great (I never let them continue wearing it once I saw it). We go over these types of things in the captains meetings...of course, the college kids do not pay attention in those.

Sorry for the long winded post, I will add more as the playoffs progress and later tonight after my games.

Thanks for the help, it is appreciated.

zebraman · #2 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2004, 05:49pm

Originally posted by HoosierBuckeye Ref
would you have any suggestions as to things to watch out for that you may have seen in your high school games this season?

The intensity level might be higher than the regular season, so make sure you are completely ready to go when the ball is tossed to start the game. If your intramural league is like my intramural league was in college, look for the keg hidden under the bleachers. :-)

During the season I was very leanient in giving T's for jewelry if I saw it as the game was taking place. I just told them to take it off, but now I realize since it is playoff time and every team is fighting for the chance to play at Assembly Hall in the final game, I am abandoning this thinking, and also the liability issue is too great (I never let them continue wearing it once I saw it).

I don't know what NCAA rules are, but under NFHS rules, taking the jewelry off is all you do. There is no T. If you see it, it comes off, period.

Sorry for the long winded post, I will add more as the playoffs progress and later tonight after my games.

Looking forward to it. Have fun!

Z

mick · #3 (**permalink**) Tue Feb 17, 2004, 11:49pm

Quote:

Originally posted by zebraman
I don't know what NCAA rules are, but under NFHS rules, taking the jewelry off is all you do. There is no T. If you see it, it comes off, period.

Good call, zebraman.

ChuckElias · #4 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 18, 2004, 10:00am

Soooooo. . . how'd it go?!?!

tomegun · #5 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 18, 2004, 10:21am

Your Username can get you in some trouble buddy! I'm a Hoosier through and through and I know you have to choose. I'm assuming you are from Ohio so I will give you a pass this time. How were the playoffs and how is school? I have a neice and nephew at IU. Don't party too much!

HoosierBuckeye Ref · #6 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 18, 2004, 12:25pm

Sorry I took so long to reply. I studied for a test last night that took place this morning. I think that is the real reason I am here, confusing sometimes...

At IU in intramural basketball, we play NFHS rules with modifications to timing and not using the bonus until the last minute of each half, then we shoot two shots automatically on all fouls. Otherwise, straight NFHS.

I had two games scheduled, the first, a forfit. The second, it was the Men's II Division (Three Men's Div., Men's 1 being the "best" competition), and I just did not get into the flow of the game. I just had some mental lapses and the team that won got up by 20 in the second half, so with a minute left in the game, we can end the game. I thought I did a decent job w/ my mechanics, and surprisingly, I did not have a travel to call all night. My partner was ok, not his fault for my not getting into the game, but you know how if you are working with someone (at least at this level) who may not have all the mechanics down to a T, but blows his whistle consistantly and communicates well helps you get into the game. I work again on Friday, and I am sure there will be a story to come out of that, since I have three games scheduled.

My roomate worked on a different court and threw the first guy out in the playoffs. He had a situation that I will post about later to get an answer (I do not remember the details) that I would also like an answer to.

I do have one question, if A1 goes up for a layup and B1 is trailing behind (far enough behind that he would not be able to block the shot or pin it against the backboard) and A1 goes up with his layup and B1 subsequently slaps the backboard as the ball is on the rim. Hopefully this makes sense. Is it basket interference or goaltending? I could not find it in the case. I appreciate the help.

I am from Ohio, thus the Buckeye reference as well (I have to cover my hometown and my school, even though both are in the Big (11) Ten).

Thanks for the interest, have a nice day.

[Edited by HoosierBuckeye Ref on Feb 18th, 2004 at 11:27 AM]

Ref in PA · #7 (**permalink**) Wed Feb 18, 2004, 12:41pm

The slap of the backboard is either a T or nothing. If you feel it was not an attempt at a block, call the T. It is not GT or BI even if it shakes the rim and you feel it causes the shot to be missed.

HoosierBuckeye Ref · #8 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 07:31pm

Ugh, too much school work this weekend.

Scheduled for 3 Friday night, first one a forefit, second one I refed, third hour ended up having no game scheduled for my court.

The single game that I did was uneventful. It was a co-ed game (2 guys, 3 females). I never like doing these because of the way the guys act when they play and how they try to take over the game.

This game was 1-3 point difference, back and forth the entire game. The only situation I had that I know I blew was a fastbreak and A1 throws the ball for a bounce pass and B1 jumps up and while in mid-air the ball deflects off his hand and then hits his foot. I called a kick because I never saw it go off his hand but only off his foot. It was a bang-bang play and B1 was the captain and (I do not know how to say this, his response was not that big of a deal) aruged but did not argue just by saying, "It hit my hand, it hit my hand!" At that moment I knew it went off his foot, but as I put the ball back into play and after thinking about it, I realized that the ball did hit his hand first.

I thought it was ironic that this happened in my game as I just read about this situation on here earlier in the week.

My intramural team lost tonight, not a big deal, I am back on the clock Monday night with a 3-game set.

Have a good week.

mick · #9 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 07:47pm

Quote:

Originally posted by HoosierBuckeye Ref
The only situation I had that I know I blew was a fastbreak and A1 throws the ball for a bounce pass and B1 jumps up and while in mid-air the ball deflects off his hand and then hits his foot. I called a kick because I never saw it go off his hand but only off his foot.

HoosierBuckeye Ref,
So, ... you knew the kick was unintentional?

mick

HoosierBuckeye Ref · #10 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 08:12pm

Mick-

You are right, I forgot to say that I knew it was intentional.

mick · #11 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 08:24pm

Quote:

Originally posted by HoosierBuckeye Ref
Mick-

You are right, I forgot to say that I knew it was intentional.

Is that your final answer?

HoosierBuckeye Ref · #12 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 09:10pm

Someone is gearing up for the return of Regis to the chair tonight.

Yes, that is my final answer.

However, I think I understand what you are trying to ask me. I know that the intention has to be there for me to have a kick violation (i.e. if A1 is planted with both feet on the ground and B1 throws the ball at A1's feet without A1 moving their feet, there is no kick violation). I see this example often in intramurals.

If I am not on the right track, let me know. Thanks!

mick · #13 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 09:22pm

Quote:

Originally posted by HoosierBuckeye Ref
Someone is gearing up for the return of Regis to the chair tonight.

Yes, that is my final answer.

However, I think I understand what you are trying to ask me. I know that the intention has to be there for me to have a kick violation (i.e. if A1 is planted with both feet on the ground and B1 throws the ball at A1's feet without A1 moving their feet, there is no kick violation). I see this example often in intramurals.

If I am not on the right track, let me know. Thanks!

The only situation I had that I know I blew was a fastbreak and A1 throws the ball for a bounce pass and B1 jumps up and while in mid-air the ball deflects off his hand and then hits his foot. I called a kick because I never saw it go off his hand but only off his foot.

What exactly did you blow? It seems to me that the only mistake you made was thinking you made a mistake. If you adjudged the ball was intentionally kicked (Player "intended" to touch the ball with his foot., and called it a kick, then there was no mistake. If the player was merely moving and his foot touched the ball as he was reaching for it, then there was probably no intention to kick the ball away from himself.

So, where did you screw up, ...if you screwed up?

mick

HoosierBuckeye Ref · #14 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 09:49pm

If the intention to kick is there, but the ball hits B1's hand THEN his foot, is it still a kick? That is what I am questioning myself on. Thanks.

mick · #15 (**permalink**) Sun Feb 22, 2004, 10:08pm

Quote:

Originally posted by HoosierBuckeye Ref
If the intention to kick is there, but the ball hits B1's hand THEN his foot, is it still a kick? That is what I am questioning myself on. Thanks.

That's a Fair question. ...Like if a tree in the forest fell....

If the player's intended kick of the ball wouldn't have happened unless it had first touched the players hand, is it still a kick?

We could equate that with a player intending to kick the ball but first it hit the floor, or first it hit another player, before it hit his intended kick.

I judge the player intentionally moved his foot to make contact with the ball and he subsequently contacted the ball with his foot. Thus, he kicked the ball. Reset the clock!

And you, Sir HoosierBuckeye Ref, made the mistake of believing you made a mistake.

mick