Sit A Tick ...

[BillyMac]

Another news update from today. It's not NFHS. It's not for the entire IAABO universe. Just for Connecticut.

Note: Connecticut has a CIAC rule that if a player gets a technical foul they must sit a tick.

Play #5: A2 is fouled and awarded 2 Free Throws. Prior to
attempting the Free Throws, A2 is assessed a Technical Foul. Team
A has no substitutes to shoot A2's free throws as A2 must "sit a
tick".
Answer: The coach of Team A picks a player on the court to
shoot A2's free throws. Team B shoots 2 free throws because of
the Technical Foul. Team B is awarded a throw in at the
Division Line. Team A must play with 4 players until the next
whistle after time has come off the clock. (IAABO Rules Guide
16:4: A)

Can anybody come up with a NFHS interpretation where playing with five trumps sitting a tick?

Hint: It's Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.'s favorite caseplay.

[Robert Goodman]

I'm just surprised to learn that the dead ball technical foul is to be resolved before the previously awarded free throws! Is this "last in, first out" resolution a general property of dead ball technical fouls? If there's more than one technical foul on the "stack" by either or both teams, do they all get resolved in LIFO order?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I'm just surprised to learn that the dead ball technical foul is to be resolved before the previously awarded free throws! Is this "last in, first out" resolution a general property of dead ball technical fouls? If there's more than one technical foul on the "stack" by either or both teams, do they all get resolved in LIFO order?

That';s not what the case play said. A shoots the FTs for the personal foul (but any A player can shoot since A2 must leave the game). Then, B shoots FTs for the T and gets the ball.

All that is the same in FED rules -- the only difference is A2 leaving the game in CT.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

That';s not what the case play said. A shoots the FTs for the personal foul (but any A player can shoot since A2 must leave the game). Then, B shoots FTs for the T and gets the ball.

All that is the same in FED rules -- the only difference is A2 leaving the game in CT.

Thanks. I was misreading

The coach of Team A picks a player on the court to
shoot A2's free throws. Team B shoots 2 free throws because of
the Technical Foul.

to mean Team A's coach picks a player of Team B who was on the court to shoot "A2's free throws", i.e. those assessed against A2.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Another news update from today. It's not NFHS. It's not for the entire IAABO universe. Just for Connecticut.

Note: Connecticut has a CIAC rule that if a player gets a technical foul they must sit a tick.

Play #5: A2 is fouled and awarded 2 Free Throws. Prior to
attempting the Free Throws, A2 is assessed a Technical Foul. Team
A has no substitutes to shoot A2's free throws as A2 must "sit a
tick".
Answer: The coach of Team A picks a player on the court to
shoot A2's free throws. Team B shoots 2 free throws because of
the Technical Foul. Team B is awarded a throw in at the
Division Line. Team A must play with 4 players until the next
whistle after time has come off the clock. (IAABO Rules Guide
16:4: A)

Can anybody come up with a NFHS interpretation where playing with five trumps sitting a tick?

Hint: It's Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.'s favorite caseplay.

The CIAC can jump up and down and scream and holler until the cows come home, but unless A2's TF was his/her 5th Foul, 2nd TF, or was a FTF, he/she will remain in the Game until he/she becomes a Disqualified Player per R4-S14-A1.

See NFHS Case Book Play 8.2 Situation B.

When I wrote the RULING for this Situation in January 2008, I told Mary Struckhoff (NFHS Basketball Rules Editor) that there were two conflicting Rules: R3-S1-A1 and R3-S3-A4, and that R3-S1-A1, NOT R3-S3-A4, was the governing Rule but she did NOT listen to me (and do not get me started), so disregard Rule reference R3-S3-A4 because R3-S1-A1 IS the governing Rule, NOT R3-S3-A4. As far as R2-S3 (The God Rule), I forget what school year that Rule reference was added to the Case Book Play but it was done without anyone on the NFHS Rules Committee consulting me as I told Mary back in January 2008 that it does NOT apply because we have R3-S1-A1.

MTD, Sr.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Can anybody come up with a NFHS interpretation where playing with five trumps sitting a tick?

Hint: It's Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.'s favorite caseplay.

8.2 SITUATION B: A1 is fouled and will be shooting two free throws. After A1’s
first free-throw attempt, B6 (Team B’s only remaining eligible substitute) replaces
B2. A1’s second free-throw attempt is unsuccessful. During rebounding action for
A1’s missed second free-throw attempt, and before the clock starts, A1 pushes B3
in the back causing B3 to roll an ankle. Team B is in the bonus. B3 is unable to
immediately continue playing. Team B requests and is granted a time out in order
to allow B3 to recover from the ankle injury so as to remain in the game. B3 is still
not able to play after the time out has ended. RULING: B2 may return to the game
and replace B3 and shoot B3’s free throw attempts despite having been replaced
since he/she is the only available substitute. (3-3-4)

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

The CIAC can jump up and down and scream and holler until the cows come home, but unless A2's TF was his/her 5th Foul, 2nd TF, or was a FTF, he/she will remain in the Game until he/she becomes a Disqualified Player per R4-S14-A1.

Sometimes playing with five does not trump sit a tick.

3.1.1 SITUATION: After six players have been disqualified, Team A has only four who are eligible to continue in the game as players. In a gesture of fair play, the coach of Team B indicates a desire to withdraw a player so that each team will have four players on the court. RULING: This is not permissible. Team B must have five players participating as long as it has that number available. If no substitute is available, a team must continue with fewer than five players. When only one player remains to participate, that team shall forfeit the game unless the referee believes this team still has an opportunity to win the game.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Sometimes playing with five does not trump sit a tick.

3.1.1 SITUATION: After six players have been disqualified, Team A has only four who are eligible to continue in the game as players. In a gesture of fair play, the coach of Team B indicates a desire to withdraw a player so that each team will have four players on the court. RULING: This is not permissible. Team B must have five players participating as long as it has that number available. If no substitute is available, a team must continue with fewer than five players. When only one player remains to participate, that team shall forfeit the game unless the referee believes this team still has an opportunity to win the game.

While NFHS R3-S1-A1 (has been in the Rules since the beginning of Time, lol, including the NBC and NCAA Men's Rules) is the governing Rule for CB Play 8.2B, it is my opinion that NFHS CB Play 3.1.1 (which has been in the Case Book for decades) pertains to the NOTE in R3-S1-A1 and is not a supporting Case Book Play for CB Play 8.2B.

MTD, Sr.

[Raymond]

I'm missing the correlation here.

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[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Raymond

I'm missing the correlation here.

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Raymond:

Correlation between what and what?

MTD, Sr.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Raymond:



Correlation between what and what?



MTD, Sr.

Billy citing 3.1.1. Nobody is sitting a tick in that situation. It's saying a coach cannot just pull their fifth player off the court if they are available.

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[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

Billy citing 3.1.1. Nobody is sitting a tick in that situation.

Agree. Bad example.