New Rules 2021-2022 Announced

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I will say I think the Men's rule is harder to officiate. But I am not going to get upset if that were to change. It would only really become an issue at the boys side for the most part and does not become a real issue at the boys side either at the high school level with many schools.

Peace

agree....is is much more difficult to tell, particularly when you have a body of officials that is at least somewhat less likely in a lot of cases to be in a good position.

[ilyazhito]

1. I would modify the closely guarded count to only operate on a held ball. With the shot clock, if a player is wasting time by dribbling in place, that's on him, not necessarily because the defender is doing a good job of containing him. However, if a player is closely guarding an opponent holding the ball, and denying him the opportunity to pass or shoot for 5 seconds, that should be rewarded. This is probably the rationale that NCAA men's, NCAA women's, and FIBA rules use to limit closely guarding rules to players holding the ball.

2. I have no issue with making that change (making blocking a ball off the backboard goaltending). Chances are that a ball off the backboard meets the criteria for goaltending anyway (above the height of the basket, on its downward flight, and with a chance to score), so there would be no confusion if that officially became the NFHS rule as well.

3. I would have to agree with not changing the 3-point line distance. Most high schoolers won't be able to shoot from the college men's line with any consistency, especially not girls. There is a reason that there is a difference between the NCAA men's and women's 3-point lines, and the WNBA and NBA 3-point lines.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

... Chances are that a ball off the backboard meets the criteria for goaltending anyway ... on its downward flight ...

Not immediately after the ball touches the backboard. Think back to your high school geometry, trigonometry, and physics classes. Now think of a typical high school layup. Ball is often released from under the ring (especially in girls high school games and most middle school games) and is moving upward after the release, it then hits the backboard, bounces (reflects) off the backboard at same angle of the incident angle, still with some upward momentum, and then continues to move upward until the force of gravity takes over and pulls it back down into the basket.

Law of Reflection happens on a pool table all the time.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Not immediately after the ball touches the backboard. Think back to your high school geometry, trigonometry, and physics classes. Now think of a typical high school layup. Ball is often released from under the ring (especially in girls high school games and most middle school games) and is moving upward after the release, it then hits the backboard, bounces (reflects) off the backboard at same angle of the incident angle, still with some upward momentum, and then continues to move upward until the force of gravity takes over and pulls it back down into the basket.

Happens on a pool table all the time.

For rules purposes, it is considered on its downward flight. It is not meant actually be seen that way. And the rule also states that if any part of the ball is above the ring, which is the case if the ball touches the backboard in almost every case. So it is just a different rule and the ball hitting the backboard is considered off-limits and has a chance to go in as well.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

For rules purposes, it is considered on its downward flight.

I kind of understand the NCAA goaltending/backboard rule (thanks anyway for the NCAA explanation), but I was 100% talking about the NFHS (high school) rule with ilyazhito.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

... think of a typical high school layup ...

In it's full context, ilyazhito was advocating automatically making blocking a ball off the backboard goaltending in high school (as in college), implying that balls in this situation were probably mostly on their downward flight anyway, and I replied with a scientific/mathematical rebuttal to a part of his post.

[ilyazhito]

Again, it depends on the angle of the shots. If a jump shot or set shot (many free throw attempts are set shots) hits the backboard, it will go down. Some layup attempts will go down as well, especially from boys who are able to jump and release the ball above the rim level. In these cases, the ball will be on its downward flight from the backboard. Changing the rule to make all balls of the backboard be considered as on their downward flight would simplify goaltending enforcement.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

If a jump shot or set shot (many free throw attempts are set shots) hits the backboard, it will go down.

Because by the trajectory, it's already on it's way down.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

... layup attempts will go down as well, especially from boys who are able to jump and release the ball above the rim level. In these cases, the ball will be on its downward flight from the backboard.

Let's be serious and keep in mind who plays games under NFHS rules? Interscholastic teams, including girls high school teams, and middle school teams of both genders. Thousands of games. Tens of thousand of players. What percentage of layup attempts in these games are immediately on the way down after the release and then immediately "reflecting" downward off the backboard?