Stupid Middle School Coach ...

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

.

White coach yells that it isn't an intentional foul. I walk across the court to calmly explain to him that since there was excessive contact, by rule, it was an intentional foul. He continues to complain that it wasn't an intentional foul. I ask him, "Was there excessive contact?", he replies that there was. I tell him that excessive contact, by rule, is an intentional foul. He says, "That's wrong". I tell him, "That's enough coach", and back away to my position to help administer.

And that is why I feel HS should change the name to match what the NCAA rules do....flagrant 1 and flagrant 2.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

And that is why I feel HS should change the name to match what the NCAA rules do....flagrant 1 and flagrant 2.

Perhaps.

Or how about making an NFHS excessive contact intentional foul a separate foul, just called an excessive contact foul, with it's own signal (maybe downward thrusting fists to side), and not a type of intentional foul. It would have the same penalty as a excessive contact intentional foul (two shots by player fouled and the ball at closest spot to the foul).

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Perhaps.

Or how about making an NFHS excessive contact intentional foul a separate foul, just called an excessive contact foul, with it's own signal (maybe downward thrusting fists to side), and not a type of intentional foul. It would have the same penalty as a excessive contact intentional foul (two shots by player fouled and the ball at closest spot to the foul).

We do not need a different foul for every possible action. It is just bad wording and needs to be changed. Coaches will still screw it up, but they will not at least have the name of the foul, thinking that that means the specific action must be intentional.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

We do not need a different foul for every possible action.

To prevent arguments like this (certainly not the first such argument of my career) the NFHS probably needs to somehow separate excessive contact intentional fouls from other "garden variety" intentional fouls to do away with the "but he was going for the ball" statement often stated by coaches, and completely take away the intentional foul signal and any "intentional foul" verbiage for such illegal excessive contact.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

To prevent arguments like this (certaibnly not the first such argument of my career) the NFHS probably needs to somehow separate excessive contact intentional fouls from other "garden variety" intentional fouls to do away with the "but he was going for the ball" statement often stated by coaches, and completely take away the intentional foul signal and any "intentional foul" verbiage for such illegal excessive contact.

I don't argue with coaches about rules. I tell them the rule and move on.

[LRZ]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

"but he was going for the ball"

Nothing will prevent arguments based on ignorance. Ignore, laugh or apply Raymond's approach. Or T.

[Stat-Man]

This fall I had a MS girls game where B1 used excessive contact on a girl driving to the basket. Coach B couldn't understand why I called an intentional foul, even with the explanation it was for excessive contact. His reaction was because he also officiates and is the president of our officials association.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Before first free throw is attempted he yells across the court "That's still wrong". Technical foul (no written warning).

I had a JV coach earlier this season want to argue a double dribble call. He somehow figured it was a hill worth dying on when he decided to end his argument with, "Go read a rule book!"

I showed him with a technical foul that I've read Rule 10-5-1 .

I'm at 16 techs through 71 games. Still left a couple out there too, those are the ones which bother me.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Stat-Man

"Go read a rule book!".

Nasty.

Along with the F word, this has got to be an almost automatic technical foul for all but the thickest skinned among us.