2019-20 NFHS: Rumors/Desires?

[JRutledge]

I was at a major conference's officiating camp. It was made very clear that we must "stop the clock" on all dead ball situations. It was even advocated because it gives you a moment to figure out what you are going to do instead of just pointing and then going in the wrong direction.

Now that is NCAA/CCA Mechanics and rules taking place but it is clear that "stopping the clock" is not going away if I just went by the attitude shared with the campers. HS officials are not as trained or even as experienced in many cases (even the younger officials).

Peace

[bucky]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I also do not think it is a waste of time. It is a way to set the tone and they can see you up close and as human.

You could have something there. As a player (captain), I was always discouraged by the meeting as it took preparation time from me and the content of what was said we already heard too many times. It was irrelevant. I find that most players today feel, or at least act, similarly. The whole team has to be disrupted to call for captains and have various players try to locate them. Yawn.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Referee’s Pregame Duties
2-2-4 Be responsible for having each team notified three minutes before each half is to begin.
2-2-5: Verify with the head coach, prior to each contest, that his/her team member’s uniforms and equipment are legal and will be worn properly, and that all participants will exhibit proper sporting behavior throughout the contest.
2-7-1 Notifying the captains when play is about to begin at the start of the game.

These are hilarious. In my entire career I have neither ever notified the teams about 3 minutes remaining in the intermission, nor have I witnessed any other official do that. Funny though, I will never forget one MS game in which my son was playing. Nobody notified the teams at half. One team came out in time but not my son's. The officials gave my son's team a technical foul. internally, I came unglued as I knew that the officials certainly made no attempt to notify the teams and they were adjudicating improperly. How hard would it have been to run to the locker room to get a team that obviously was not notified? And T in MS for this? Get real.

Verifying with a coach about equipment is ridiculous. I am yet to witness a coach say "no" when asked if they were properly equipped. Their answer is irrelevant. And, what would you do if they answered "no"? Not start the game? When in those positions and hearing coaches asked, the standard response is "they should be".

My son, a sociologist, often talks about the importance of rituals and traditions in our culture.

Have him ask the family members of those that were burned at the stake about the importance of rituals and traditions.

Sure, some are important, but just because it is a ritual/tradition, does not make it important by default.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bucky

Have him ask the family members of those that were burned at the stake about the importance of rituals and traditions.

Enjoy blowing out the birthday candles on your birthday omelet, and singing Stayin' Alive during the seventh inning stretch of a baseball game.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bucky

In my entire career I have neither ever notified the teams about 3 minutes remaining in the intermission, nor have I witnessed any other official do that.

Neither have I, over almost forty years. The rule states that it is the responsibility of the referee to have each team notified three minutes before each half is to begin.

We don't notify the teams ourselves, but simply have the timekeepers do it. If I'm the referee, when I grab my jacket at the beginning of the halftime intermission, I just say to the timekeeper, "Notify both teams and the officials when there are three minutes left in halftime".

However, I will admit that many timekeepers are negligent in doing this, even when asked.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bucky

Verifying with a coach about equipment is ridiculous. I am yet to witness a coach say "no" when asked if they were properly equipped. Their answer is irrelevant. And, what would you do if they answered "no"? Not start the game? When in those positions and hearing coaches asked, the standard response is "they should be".

Why ask? Who says we have to ask? I don't ask. I mention it and then point out any visible problems that I might have observed pregame, and then tell the coach to take care of said problems before the game starts.

Headbands and wristbands are usually easy. If the players have warmups on it may be impossible to observe other problems pregame, but if we know that some problems do exist, they can be taken care of by the coach pregame, otherwise some starters or substitutes may be delayed getting into the game.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Why ask? Who says we have to ask?

Some states make it a requirement. And, it has more to do with any required safety equipment, and getting the burden (at least in some partial legal theory) off of the officials.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Some states make it a requirement.

I've often heard that here on the Forum, so I agree.

But that's on the state, not on the NFHS.

If I don't see any "fashion" problems in the pregame warmups, I will just say to the coaches "Coaches, please make sure that your uniforms and equipment are legal, and will be worn properly, and that all participants will exhibit good sportsmanship".

Short and sweet, and hopefully fulfilling my NFHS requirement of verification.

I may add a statement regarding the coaching box, or about thirty/sixty second timeouts, but that depends on my mood, who the coaches are, who my partner is, and whether I'm the referee, or the umpire.

[bucky]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

The rule states that it is the responsibility of the referee to have each team notified three minutes before each half is to begin.

If I'm the referee, when I grab my jacket at the beginning of the halftime intermission, I just say to the timekeeper, "Notify both teams and the officials when there are three minutes left in halftime".

Yes, "have", but the point is the same. I have never done it and have never seen any other referee tell anybody to have the teams notified. Never.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Why ask? Who says we have to ask?

Um, I thought you (NFHS) did when you posted:

"Referee’s Pregame Duties
2-2-5: Verify with the head coach, prior to each contest, that his/her team member’s uniforms and equipment are legal and will be worn properly, and that all participants will exhibit proper sporting behavior throughout the contest."

Verifying carries with it the same context as asking IMO. It is impossible to verify with a coach that all participants will exhibit proper sporting behavior throughout the contest. No one can predict the future can they? And few coaches are aware of what their players are wearing. Coaches may at times go out of their way to point certain items out (thick padding, mask, etc.), but only because they may be abnormal. I understand that the point is to simply plant the idea that everyone is good to go, but my point is that, to me, this, in the rules, is irrelevant to the game and that very few officials do it. Also, that the coaches could answer with a "no" or that they give an insincere (because they are not sure) "yes" or that they use the default answer of "should be."

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Certainly fulfills the requirement of the teams being notified.

Yes, there are horns to notify teams but there are few teams in locker rooms that can hear them. Come to think of it, I have never heard a 3-minute warning horn from an officials locker room and have never heard one that was simultaneous with someone knocking on the door to personally notify us. Where are these gym and locker rooms where people can hear a horn at 3 minutes? And for college games, rarely can you hear a horn from a locker room. That's what makes having the clock in the officials locker room so nice. I would not call it fulfilling the requirement if there is a possibility that a team may not hear it.

I can see it now:

Coach: Why didn't anyone come get us?
Official: Sorry, you should have been able to hear the horn from your locker room that was down the hall and through two doors.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by bucky

...Where are these gym and locker rooms where people can hear a horn at 3 minutes? And for college games, rarely can you hear a horn from a locker room. That's what makes having the clock in the officials locker room so nice. I would not call it fulfilling the requirement if there is a possibility that a team may not hear it.

You guys need stronger horns.

Originally Posted by bucky

I can see it now:

Coach: Why didn't anyone come get us?
Official: Sorry, you should have been able to hear the horn from your locker room that was down the hall and through two doors.

If a team isn't back by the 1:00 mark, I send someone to go get them.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bucky

Verifying carries with it the same context as asking IMO

Here in my little corner of Connecticut:

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I don't ask. I mention it and then point out any visible problems that I might have observed pregame, and then tell the coach to take care of said problems before the game starts ... problems do exist, they can be taken care of by the coach pregame, otherwise some starters or substitutes may be delayed getting into the game.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

If I don't see any "fashion" problems in the pregame warmups, I will just say to the coaches "Coaches, please make sure that your uniforms and equipment are legal, and will be worn properly, and that all participants will exhibit good sportsmanship". Short and sweet, and hopefully fulfilling my NFHS requirement of verification.

We don't ask simply because most coaches have no idea what's legal and what's illegal and really don't know how to answer.

I can understand why some will "ask" to verify, but it's there's another way to verify without asking, I say go for it.

Remember, it's all about the purpose and intent of the rule, not necessarily the literal rule as written.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bucky

In my entire career I have neither ever notified the teams about 3 minutes remaining in the intermission, nor have I witnessed any other official do that ... MS game in which my son was playing. Nobody notified the teams at half ... The officials gave my son's team a technical foul. ... I knew that the officials certainly made no attempt to notify the teams and they were adjudicating improperly.

There seems to be a disconnect with what you don't do as an official and what you expect other officials to do when you're a basketball parent.

[Altor]

Originally Posted by bucky

In my entire career I have neither ever notified the teams about 3 minutes remaining in the intermission, nor have I witnessed any other official do that.

The schools around here simply have the timer sound the horn three times when the clock reaches 3 minutes.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Altor

The schools around here simply have the timer sound the horn three times when the clock reaches 3 minutes.

That is the case in Indiana. Every gym has a horn going off. I noticed this first when I would do college games in Indiana and obviously noticed it when I started doing HS games here too.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Altor

The schools around here simply have the timer sound the horn three times when the clock reaches 3 minutes.

Certainly fulfills the requirement of the teams being notified.