Scorekeeper at Table

[bob jenkins]

A friend who is a scorekeeper tells me that he read "somewhere" in a FED publication that the scoreKEEPER (or his representative) was required to remain at the table during the game.

I know the rules book indicates that is true for the score BOOK, but I can't find anythink about the keeper. That said, I only have the rules and case books.

Is there something in the comic book, the mechanics manual, the "history" book (I forget what it's called) that has this?

[LRZ]

Not to my knowledge, Bob.

You would think that such a requirement, if it did exist, would appear in the most accessible NFHS publication, the rule book, and in the most likely section, 2-11-11. It would have been simple to state, "The official scorebook and scorer shall remain at the scorer’s table throughout the game, including all intermissions."

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

A friend who is a scorekeeper tells me that he read "somewhere" in a FED publication that the scoreKEEPER (or his representative) was required to remain at the table during the game.

My rulebooks only go back to 1996-97, and from that point on it was only the scorebook that had to remain at the table during the halftime intermission.

However, I do have a NFHS Instructions To And Duties Of Scorers For Basketball Games dated July, 1980 (Printed By National Federation) that states: During Intermissions: 1) Either the official scorer or a delegated assistant must be at the scorer's table with the official scorebook at all times.

This appears to be an official NFHS publication (printed on blue paperboard), and it's in pretty good shape except for the Woolly Mammoth footprint on it.

Instructions To And Duties Of Timers For Basketball Games is printed on the back side. I found it with National Federation Official Basketball Signals, also dated July, 1980, printed on pink paperboard.

Mark T. DeNucci, Sr. is going to be so proud of me.

2-11 The official scorebook shall remain at the scorer’s table throughout the game, including all intermissions.

2.11.11 SITUATION: Team A’s scorebook is the official scorebook for the game. Team A’s scorer is requested by Team A’s head coach to bring the scorebook to the locker room at halftime to review several pieces of information. RULING: Prohibited; the scorebook shall remain at the table throughout the game, including all intermissions. There is no specific penalty for removing the scorebook; however, if the officials believe the scorebook was removed as an unsporting act, it could be penalized accordingly. (10-1-8; 10-3-6; 10-4-1)

[LRZ]

BillyMac must have access to MTD's attic; I don't.

1980, the year I first got certified. I must have never seen that, never even knew it existed.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by LRZ

BillyMac must have access to MTD's attic; 1980, the year I first got certified. I must have never seen that, never even knew it existed.

I actually wasted my time looking for this. All it took was a few clicks of my mouse and I found a NFHS Instructions To And Duties Of Scorers For Basketball Games dated May 11, 2018, that has the exact guideline as the 1980 guideline: During Intermissions: 1) Either the official scorer or a delegated assistant must be at the scorer's table with the official scorebook at all times.

https://www.nfhs.org/media/1018426/2...ers_sheets.pdf

[LRZ]

Nice work, Billy.

Why would NFHS not add that requirement to the rule book? How many people--refs, scorers, ADs, etc.--would look on the NFHS publication page? Not to drag this discussion out, but if the requirement is not in the rule book, but only in some auxiliary publication, how authoritative is it? And, of course, there does not seem to be a penalty for a violation.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by LRZ

Why would NFHS not add that requirement to the rule book? How many people--refs, scorers, ADs, etc.--would look on the NFHS publication page?

Why? Because it's the NFHS. 'Nough said.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I actually wasted my time looking for this. All it took was a few clicks of my mouse and I found a NFHS Instructions To And Duties Of Scorers For Basketball Games dated May 11, 2018, that has the exact guideline as the 1980 guideline: During Intermissions: 1) Either the official scorer or a delegated assistant must be at the scorer's table with the official scorebook at all times.

https://www.nfhs.org/media/1018426/2...ers_sheets.pdf

Thanks. I'll pass it along to this person.

[Altor]

Originally Posted by LRZ

Nice work, Billy.

Why would NFHS not add that requirement to the rule book? How many people--refs, scorers, ADs, etc.--would look on the NFHS publication page? Not to drag this discussion out, but if the requirement is not in the rule book, but only in some auxiliary publication, how authoritative is it? And, of course, there does not seem to be a penalty for a violation.

Don't you have an officials' manual that details various mechanics for you to use during game play? Are all those things in the rule book? That's all this publication is, a reference for the duties of the scorekeeper.

Somebody needs to stay with the book that is required to stay at the table so that its integrity isn't compromised. There's nothing more to it than that.

[LRZ]

The rule book outlines the duties of the officials, including scorers, and is the obvious place to look. A document buried on the NFHS website is an obscure source, easily overlooked. If bob jenkins didn't know about it, don't you think that is an indication of the source's obscurity?

I understand the reasoning, thank you. But conceding that protecting the integrity of the scorebook is so critical, wouldn't you think the requirement would appear in a more readily accessible place, like the rule book?

But, if you wish, you can have the last word.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by LRZ

If bob jenkins didn't know about it, don't you think that is an indication of the source's obscurity?

That also surprised me. I even gave thought to the idea that somebody hacked bob jenkins' username and posted using his name.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

I believe the requirement for the Book to remain at the Table was put into the Rules in the late mid-1970s (before the 1976-77 season) but it may have been in the late 1970s.

I remember replacing the Scorer at half time of a boys' VAR game in California, either the 1982-83 season or the 1983-84 season. We hadn't been in the dressing room two minutes when the Visitor's HC was knocking on the door wanting to let us know that the Book was not at the Table. We went out to the Table. The Scorer (the Home HC's wife) was sitting at the Table. I asked her where the Book was and she told me that she had taken it to her husband. I reminded her that the Book was to not leave the Table and she was to retrieve the Book immediately. She looked straight in the eye that she always takes the Book to her husband and that she would not go get it. By this time the Home AD was at the Table. I told that two of them that they had 90 seconds to get return the Book to the Table. The AD told the HC's wife to retrieve the Book and she told him no, . The AD looked at me with a look of exasperation and I told him to replace her. And he did. He was our Scorer of the Second Half. The Home HC was not happy the whole Second Half but he treaded lightly with my partner and me.

MTD, Sr.