Girls Just Want To Have Fun (Cyndi Lauper, 1979) ...

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Kansas Ref

I have written to the NF about jump balls---suggesting to them that its not needed--just give the initial possession to Visitor team. I did get a response saying that the "jump ball" was something that was rooted in the history of the game it will not be removed.

Are you sure that you didn't mistakenly write to Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.? He's the only person in the world that likes jump balls. Something about being a college roommate of James Naismith.

I suppose that the NFHS is upset that we've done away with chicken wire all the way around the basketball court? It's rooted in the history of the game. That's why basketball players are still called "Cagers".

[ilyazhito]

Originally Posted by Kansas Ref

I have written to the NF about jump balls---suggesting to them that its not needed--just give the initail possession to Visitor team. I did get a response saying that the "jump ball" was something that was rooted in the history of the game it will not be removed. Alas,

I like jump balls as well. The AP arrow gets confusing to remember, especially if you have an incompetent (or distracted) table staff, who forget to (re)set the arrow. If Euroleague and NBA can make jump balls work, and jump balls were in the NFHS and NCAA game until the 1980s, there is no reason why jump balls can't be restored. There is no reason why scholastic basketball can't have jump balls and shot clocks at the same time .

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

I like jump balls as well.

Even though I'm pretty sure that you know them (you seem like a rules oriented kind of guy), can you recite all the jump ball rules without peeking at the rulebook? Based on original positions of players, jumpers, nonjumpers, on the circle, off the circle, who can move, limits of movement, crossing lines, before the toss, during the toss, after the toss, limitations of the jumpers, and process, interpret, and enforce, all these rules within the fraction of a second that it takes for a jump ball?

If so, you're a better basketball official than I am, ilyazhito" (with apologies to Rudyard Kipling).

[so cal lurker]

Me thinks that refs (and players) knew the jump rules better when they occurred more than once per game . . .

[ilyazhito]

Non-jumpers who are on the circle may move off the circle, but non-jumpers who are off the circle may not move onto the circle until the jump ball is touched. Jumpers cannot catch the tossed ball, tap the ball before it reaches its highest point, touch the tossed ball more than twice, or leave the circle until the jump ball ends (it is touched by (or touches) a non-jumper or an official, it hits the floor, backboard, or ring, or goes out of bounds).

It would also be interesting to actually officiate a jump ball that is not in the center circle, because the current 3-person mechanics for a jump ball are designed for center-circle jump balls (the Umpires stand diagonally across from each other on opposite sides of the Referee (the tossing official)). Would the Referee still toss the jump balls outside the center circle, with Umpires in the usual configuration, or would there be different positions (such as the non-tossing officials at Lead and Trail tableside, with the tossing official as Center Opposite)? The 2-person mechanics for non-center circle jump balls would also have to be developed (U might be closer to the table than R, to properly start the clock). I'd be interested to see what NBA, or old NFHS/NCAA manuals from the time when jump balls were still a thing, do to address jump balls outside the center circle.

The only question is would NFHS seriously consider a proposal to re-institute the jump ball for situations other than the start of a period/overtime.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Are you sure that you didn't mistakenly write to Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.? He's the only person in the world that likes jump balls. Something about being a college roommate of James Naismith.

I suppose that the NFHS is upset that we've done away with chicken wire all the way around the basketball court? It's rooted in the history of the game. That's why basketball players are still called "Cagers".

Billy will tell every one that I am not a fan of AP and I have humorously referred to it as an abomination upon the game. In reality, I can live with even though going back having Jump Balls is still better way to put the Ball back into play especially for Held Balls.

What is really an abomination upon the game and I do mean that seriously, is the Restricted Arc in NCAA Men's and Women's, NBA/WNBA, and FIBA, and the Lower Defensive Block in NCAA Women's. I am going to end my comment now because it "really grinds my gears". There also two other things in NFHS and NCAA Men's and Women's that also "grinds my gears" but I don't want to go into it now.

MTD, Sr.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

Non-jumpers who are on the circle may move off the circle, but non-jumpers who are off the circle may not move onto the circle until the jump ball is touched. Jumpers cannot catch the tossed ball, tap the ball before it reaches its highest point, touch the tossed ball more than twice, or leave the circle until the jump ball ends (it is touched by (or touches) a non-jumper or an official, it hits the floor, backboard, or ring, or goes out of bounds).

You have disappointed me grasshopper.

When the official is ready and until the ball is tossed, nonjumpers shall not change position around the center restraining circle.

There may be more.

The jumpers are quite easy to deal with.

It's the nonjumpers that have complex limitations.

And keep in mind that you have to process, interpret, and enforce, all these rules within the fraction of a second that it takes for a jump ball.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Me thinks that refs (and players) knew the jump rules better when they occurred more than once per game . . .

Damn straight. Several jump balls a game at three different jump ball circles.

Coaches had jump ball plays depending on the matchups and where the jump ball was.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

What is really an abomination upon the game and I do mean that seriously, is the Restricted Arc in NCAA Men's and Women's, NBA/WNBA, and FIBA, and the Lower Defensive Block in NCAA Women's.

Off topic. Fifteen yard penalty. Replay down.

[justacoach]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

You have disappointed me grasshopper.

If you want to avoid him disappointing you, ask him some esoteric questions about the experimental G-League 5 man rotation scheme.

I'm thinking he can recite the perfect answers from the top of his head. Trivial HS stuff, not so much....

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Off topic. Fifteen yard penalty. Replay down.

I think the correct penalty is an Indirect Free Kick.

MTD, Sr.

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Coaches had jump ball plays depending on the matchups and where the jump ball was.

I had thought jump ball plays had gone completely out of style, but I've seen a couple successful ones this year. Perhaps they are successful because the other team expects the normal routine of slowly setting up the half court offense to start the game.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

I had thought jump ball plays had gone completely out of style, but I've seen a couple successful ones this year. Perhaps they are successful because the other team expects the normal routine of slowly setting up the half court offense to start the game.

Back when I was coaching middle school and had a tall jumper, my favorite play was to line all four of my nonjumpers on the circle and have one break (usually on the front right of the jumper) long to our basket the split second the referee made a move to toss, have the jumper attempt a very long tap upcourt, and if things went well, we lead two to zero on an easy wide open right handed layup.

The key was to remind both officials before the game that nonjumpers on the circle can legally leave the circle at any time, before, during, or after the toss.

[ilyazhito]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

I think the correct penalty is an Indirect Free Kick.

MTD, Sr.

Objection, Your Honor! The statement by my opponent is irrelevant.

I would also assess an administrative technical foul for content irrelevant to the topic requiring me to enter it into the scorebook.

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

You have disappointed me grasshopper.

Please. No. Don't anybody even suggest to BillyMac anything about the 70's smash hit "Kung Foo Fighting." He'll probably post the lyrics.

"Let's get it on!'