What's in your pregame?

[LRZ]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

I was being serious about the reminder [/sarcasm]. Maybe I need to overload my posts with emoticons, to assist the humor-challenged .

You have a tendency to overstate the obvious, so it is no surprise that your attempts at humor and sarcasm often go unrecognized. You also lecture, often in response to comments by officials who began working before you were even born.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

I was being serious about the reminder [/sarcasm]. Maybe I need to overload my posts with emoticons, to assist the humor-challenged .

However, veteran officials who work mostly one game or the other might not be familiar with the aspects of the other game, such as a college official being invited to work a high school playoff game (assuming he works the minimum amount of varsity required in his state to be eligible for playoffs), or a high school official being occasionally called on to do the odd JuCo or DIII game. In that case, a short "OK, we're doing high school/college tonight. Any questions?" might be good to start the discussion. Officials new to the college level might also benefit from a reminder, as well as going over the differences in rules and procedures. However, this would be up to the judgement of the R that day.

So you have worked a college game? How do you know what officials at that level know and you have never worked a game at that level?

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by ilyazhito

I was being serious about the reminder [/sarcasm]. Maybe I need to overload my posts with emoticons, to assist the humor-challenged .

However, veteran officials who work mostly one game or the other might not be familiar with the aspects of the other game, such as a college official being invited to work a high school playoff game (assuming he works the minimum amount of varsity required in his state to be eligible for playoffs), or a high school official being occasionally called on to do the odd JuCo or DIII game. In that case, a short "OK, we're doing high school/college tonight. Any questions?" might be good to start the discussion. Officials new to the college level might also benefit from a reminder, as well as going over the differences in rules and procedures. However, this would be up to the judgement of the R that day.

Unless I'm working with a friend, my partners at either level do not know that I work in the other level. I don't bring up HS when I'm in a college locker room. In my HS locker rooms, I know the HS rules better than 95% of my partners, so even if they know I also work college ball, they have no reason to remind me I'm working a HS game.

Safest bet is again, when at a HS venue, discuss HS officiating. When at a college venue, discuss college officiating. Don't try to get in everybody's head.

Every summer I work a local Pro-Am that uses NBA rules and mechanics. The 2 NBA officials who oversee the officiating (and occasionally work on the court with us) never bring up HS or college rules/mechanics/signals. They talk to us about NBA rules/mechanics/signals. Only reference to HS or college is "do what your are supposed to do at the level you are working that day".

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Raymond

It's very presumptuous for any official to assume his/her partner needs a reminder about which rule set is being used.

Over 90% of our high school level games use NFHS rules. The other 10% involve private prep schools that use an odd set of hybrid NFHS/NCAA rules (sometimes the coaches don't even know the differences). When we work these private prep school games the "Prep School Handout" always comes out (initiated by either me, or my partner) because both of us need reminders about the rules that we're going to use that night.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Over 90% of our high school level games use NFHS rules. The other 10% involve private prep schools that use an odd set of hybrid NFHS/NCAA rules (sometimes the coaches don't even know the differences). When we work these private prep school games the "Prep School Handout" comes out because both of us need reminders about the rules that we're going to use that night.

There's nothing wrong with that. That's appropriate considering the environment in which you work.

But I know quite a few officials who would be offended if somebody were to assume that they didn't know high school rules and need to be reminded of them just because they also work College ball and vice versa.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[ilyazhito]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Over 90% of our high school level games use NFHS rules. The other 10% involve private prep schools that use an odd set of hybrid NFHS/NCAA rules (sometimes the coaches don't even know the differences). When we work these private prep school games the "Prep School Handout" always comes out (initiated by either me, or my partner) because both of us need reminders about the rules that we're going to use that night.

Billy, officials in the DMV are in the same boat. The bigger private school leagues use rules that are a hybrid of NFHS and NCAA (dunking is allowed in warmups, the coaching box rule is copied from college, boys games use the NCAA men's rules on inbound spots, and the shot clock and related rules (backcourt counts and closely guarded counts) follow NCAA rules of the appropriate gender). Public high school games in DC and MD use the shot clock (VA does not), so the related rules (backcourt and closely guarded count) also differ between leagues, and the mercy rules for each league are different. This means that officials must be absolutely sure as to what set of rules they are using that day, and why every pre-game begins with a reminder of today's rules. You have "Connecticut only" quirks, I have DMV quirks that I need to take into account in my games.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Raymond

Only officials in the Nutmeg state can do this mechanic?

This has been an often used mechanic around her for years and I cannot think of many times if any this was discussed as a pre-game item.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Connecticut Only: Point to floor for two point field goal try when shooter has foot touching three point line.

Originally Posted by Raymond

Only officials in the Nutmeg state can do this mechanic?

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This has been an often used mechanic around her for years ...

I don't have access to a NFHS Mechanics Manual and/or signal chart, but I do know that this is not an official IAABO mechanic and/or signal. "Connecticut only" means that our state interpreter has encouraged us to go "outside the IAABO box" for this specific play.

We used to have another "Connecticut only" mechanic: No long switches in the backcourt when there is no change in possession unless free throws are going to be attempted.

When done correctly, it worked great. Foul on the defense in the backcourt, no free throws, trail moves up to the reporting area, reports the foul and moves back into the backcourt to administer the throwin. Lead stays put. Simple. Right?

The problem was that we had many officials who either didn't understand the mechanic, or were downright lazy. We had varsity guys in high school varsity games not switching like they were in a recreation or travel game. We had guys not switch on player control fouls. It lasted a year, or two, and we had to go back to switching on all fouls.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

I don't have access to a NFHS Mechanics Manual and/or signal chart, but I do know that this is not an official IAABO mechanic and/or signal. "Connecticut only" means that our state interpreter has encouraged us to go "outside the IAABO box" for this specific play.

We do a lot of things that are not "approved" but they are just things you do to officiate. Not everything we do goes through some committee to decide what to do.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

We used to have another "Connecticut only" mechanic: No long switches in the backcourt when there is no change in possession unless free throws are going to be attempted.

When done correctly, it worked great. Foul on the defense in the backcourt, no free throws, trail moves up to the reporting area, reports the foul and moves back into the backcourt to administer the throwin. Lead stays put. Simple. Right?

We do basically the same thing in Illinois. But why would you need to have this conversation about your state as something specific? Even if we have people from other states, we do not need to get into what other states do as a norm because most people do not work in other states in my experience.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

The problem was that we had many officials who either didn't understand the mechanic, or were downright lazy. We had varsity guys in high school varsity games not switching like they were in a recreation or travel game. We had guys not switch on player control fouls. It lasted a year, or two, and we had to go back to switching on all fouls.

OK. We have issues with our long switch rules because people usually are confused and do it wrong. Not a big deal and even when we talk about it, people still screw up. It is more of a laugh off thing here.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

We do a lot of things that are not "approved"

We don't. Other than the "Connecticut only" exceptions, we (meaning our local high school assignment board) do everything by the book, the IAABO Mechanics Manual. That's how we train new officials. That's what we base our continuing education on. New officials can learn, among other ways, by "looking it up". Older officials can get a questions answered by, among other ways, "looking it up". That's what young officials, looking for good role models, observe veteran officials doing. That's a part, and only a part, of how we evaluate officials. For an official looking to improve their mechanics, either a rookie, or a veteran, it's less confusing if everybody is doing everything the same way. Consistency is a good thing.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

But why would you need to have this conversation about your state as something specific?

Because that's the way we do it in Connecticut. We don't know, and we really don't care, what other IAABO states are doing. Do other IAABO states follow the IAABO Mechanics Manual 100%? Do other states, like Connecticut, make some slight changes to the IAABO Mechanics Manual? We really don't care.

If I move out of state, then I'll have to know, and I'll have to care, but I sincerely doubt that that will happen.

[JRutledge]

Billy you kind of missed the point. I was not suggesting that it is always OK to use signals that have not been approved. My point is that many areas have mechanics that are not talked about. For example, do you guys have a signal to tell your partners the bonus situation? Did you guys use a kick signal before it was an actual approved signal? What about the "run the end line" signal? So if you didn't, then your area must have been the only one not using those signals, because they were very common in my area and when I watched games on TV before those signals were approved. It was not a big deal. That is why I asked the question I did about your emphasis on "Connecticut only" mechanic.

And also I actually love the IAABO "You make the ruling" videos, but much of the officials are using signals that are not approved. Not sure where all the videos come from, but I doubt these games are just anyone calling these games. These games look like big tournaments or state tournament level games.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

We have issues with our long switch rules because people usually are confused and do it wrong.

At least your guys had a half-good reason, confusion. Better than laziness, which is the problem we had here in Connecticut, and the main reason why we went back to switching on every foul.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Connecticut Only
Point to floor for two point field goal try when shooter has foot touching three point line.
Team members are not allowed to congregate at division line, or on school logo, during introductions.
Captains, Head Coaches, Officials pregame meeting should occur prior to start of game. If the head coach
refuses to attend the meeting, notify Commissioner.

Originally Posted by JRutledge

But why would you need to have this conversation about your state as something specific?

Sorry JRutledge. I didn't really answer your question the first time and just realized this while rereading the thread.

The "Connecticut Only" section is not really a regular part of my pregame. I put it with the Rule Changes, and Points of Emphasis, because like them, these "Connecticut Only" items may change from year to year. I will only mention a "Connecticut Only" item in my pregame when there is a new change, which hasn't happened in several years, and like the Rule Changes, and Points of Emphasis, only pregame these at the beginning of the season.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Connecticut Only: Team members are not allowed to congregate at division line, or on school logo, during introductions.

This (above) seems to be already covered by this (below):

2011-12 NFHS POINTS OF EMPHASIS: 1. SPORTING BEHAVIOR. The NFHS Basketball Rules Committee continues to be concerned about the following behaviors: A. Pregame Situations ... Gatherings intended to motivate a team after the warm-up period, during or following player introductions ... should be performed in the area directly in front of the team bench.

I believe that we stress this here in Connecticut because we had several incidents in the state of visiting players spitting on the home team's jump ball circle logo during pregame introductions. Our state interscholastic sports governing body wants officials to prevent such behavior.

Plus, if we didn't list it as a "Connecticut only", those who became officials after 2011-12 wouldn't know about this NFHS Point of Emphasis. When will the NFHS learn to add Points of Emphasis to the rulebook as needed. Not all, just as needed, like the contact above the shoulders Point of Emphasis from 2012-13.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

This (above) seems to be already covered by this (below):

2011-12 NFHS POINTS OF EMPHASIS: 1. SPORTING BEHAVIOR. The NFHS Basketball Rules Committee continues to be concerned about the following behaviors: A. Pregame Situations ... Gatherings intended to motivate a team after the warm-up period, during or following player introductions ... should be performed in the area directly in front of the team bench.

I believe that we stress this here in Connecticut because we had several incidents in the state of visiting players spitting on the home team's jump ball circle logo during pregame introductions. Our state interscholastic sports governing body wants officials to prevent such behavior.

Why weren't officials calling Technical Fouls for this behavior?

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Plus, if we didn't list it as a "Connecticut only", those who became officials after 2011-12 wouldn't know about this NFHS Point of Emphasis. ...

Well, that is not "Connecticut only". It's in the Virginia pre-season NFHS rules clinic every year.