You call the make - er, I mean, you make the call

[Mark Padgett]

I guess the foul was called on number double zero for a trip?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHSPqqVh7tw&t=15s

[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

I guess the foul was called on number double zero for a trip?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHSPqqVh7tw&t=15s

I've seen this... awful call. I do not see any foul. Not to mention that she hops on the one foot, while holding the ball, before she shoots so it should have been traveling anyway.

[Stat-Man]

After the made three-point basket by white, it looks like W#22 knocked the ball away from B#00. Possible delay violation?

As for the actual play, I don't see any contact. I think W#22 was bracing for, and anticipating, it. Without seeing where the official was, I can only question whether or not he had a good angle/look at the play from his spot.

[Mbilica]

This is a ridiculous thread. We should call this thread "lets all crucify these refs". With the camera angle that is not able to see the contact between the shooter and the two defenders who contact the shooter, it is simply not possible to determine what the official saw. The official was in perfect position to see the space between the opposing players and made a call. The people who put this video together did not do so to develop officiating. In fact, I would suggest that people who think these refs "decided the game" should take a ref course and join a local Oklahoma IAABO association. Naturally, officials are human and even the best officials miss calls. How about the decision by the player to loft a pass to nowhere that gave the player a chance to throw up a desperation shot? The team is also to blame for putting themselves in a position where an official's judgement could decide the game. Officiating judgements are a part of the game, just like passing, shooting, and coaching. We need to get over ourselves and stop teaching our kids that referees are stealing the joy of the game. I belong to an IAABO association and work with dozens of other officials each season. I have never met one who cares about which team wins. The very idea thay officials would decide a game in favor of one team over another is an insult to officials everywhere.

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[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Mbilica

This is a ridiculous thread. We should call this thread "lets all crucify these refs". With the camera angle that is not able to see the contact between the shooter and the two defenders who contact the shooter, it is simply not possible to determine what the official saw. The official was in perfect position to see the space between the opposing players and made a call. The people who put this video together did not do so to develop officiating. In fact, I would suggest that people who think these refs "decided the game" should take a ref course and join a local Oklahoma IAABO association. Naturally, officials are human and even the best officials miss calls. How about the decision by the player to loft a pass to nowhere that gave the player a chance to throw up a desperation shot? The team is also to blame for putting themselves in a position where an official's judgement could decide the game. Officiating judgements are a part of the game, just like passing, shooting, and coaching. We need to get over ourselves and stop teaching our kids that referees are stealing the joy of the game.

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Watching, critiquing, and discussing plays like this is a great way to learn. Nobody here is calling the officials dumb or incompetent.

However, and I'm sure the officials themselves worked agree, this was a bad call. We've all made them, too.

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[Mbilica]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Watching, critiquing, and discussing plays like this is a great way to learn. Nobody here is calling the officials dumb or incompetent.

However, and I'm sure the officials themselves worked agree, this was a bad call. We've all made them, too.

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The title of the video is "Referee decides game...." After my first sentence, I proceed to address the individuals who produced and published this video.

My initial comment is because this is a public forum and a lot of nonofficials belong to it and post here. I appreciate the value of film to learn from. I just don't see much value in this film because the angle doesn't show us the contact. We can speculate that the shooter was out of control and that we don't want to bail her out by calling a foul for minor contact. But, we can't see the contact. Maybe it was enough to warrant a call. Keep in mind that we can't see his signal to the table. It could have been a foul on either 00 or 24. It is important to point out that it might have been a correct call.

From an officiating standpoint, the other official's three point score signal got my attention. He puts up both hands and proceeds to jump up and down slightly. There is no reason for the extra bounce. Just firmly raise both hands and move to the next position.

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[BryanV21]

Originally Posted by Mbilica

The title of the video is "Referee decides game...."

This is a public forum and a lot of nonofficials belong to it and post here. I appreciate the value of film to learn from. I just don't see much value in this film because the angle doesn't show us the contact. We can speculate that the shooter was out of control and that we don't want to bail her out by calling a foul for minor contact. But, we can't see the contact. Maybe it was enough to warrant a call.

From an officiating standpoint, the other official's three point score signal got my attention. He puts up both hands and proceeds to jump up and down slightly. There is no reason for the extra bounce. Just firmly raise both hands and move to the next position.

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Forget what the officials did or didn't see. That's not the point. The point is this... What is the correct call?

Again, nobody is bashing the refs. Was the name of the video (sorry, misunderstood the previous comment and thought he was referring to what Mark named the thread) bad? Yes, but who cares? Do you see how many poorly named videos are on Youtube and the rest of the internet? That shouldn't keep us from using that video as a way to learn.

You're starting to sound like a conspiracy theorist trying to find fault where there's none.

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[Mbilica]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Forget what the officials did or didn't see. That's not the point. The point is this... What is the correct call?

Again, nobody is bashing the refs. Was the name of the thread bad? Perhaps so. But the man that made it is highly respected around here and in the profession.

You're starting to sound like a conspiracy theorist trying to find fault where there's none.

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Officials should tread very carefully when posting videos on public forums, even for learning purposes. I am pointing out that there are better ways to present plays in which we think an official made an incorrect call.

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[ODog]

Originally Posted by Mbilica

Keep in mind that we can't see his signal to the table. It could have been a foul on either 00 or 24. It is important to point out that it might have been a correct call.

He calls a push on 24.

You're in the overwhelming minority who reserves the possibility there might've actually been one.

But yes, we've all made one up and/or hallucinated one and have had to live with it. Tough spot.

[Mbilica]

Originally Posted by ODog

He calls a push on 24.

You're in the overwhelming minority who reserves the possibility there might've actually been one.
.

I recognize that. I am certainly not a top level official. I make my own share of mistakes and have a lot to learn. I also have a GREAT deal of respect for Mark Padgett and the other officials on this forum. I also agree that, from this perspective, it looks like an incorrect call.

Basketball is an incredibly difficult sport to officiate in which the difference between seeing the relevant contact and being blocked out is often a razor-thin margin. The fans and coaches also take every opportunity to loudly criticize you if they feel your calls are disadvantaging their team.

Personally, I have a few years of development yet before I will be ready to work such a high level game as the one this video was taken from.

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[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Stat-Man

After the made three-point basket by white, it looks like W#22 knocked the ball away from B#00. Possible delay violation?
....

White is losing, calling a delay benefits them, not the throw-in team.

[JRutledge]

All I have to say, is you really want to see a bad call, you can look at the next video.

Sorry Rich.

Peace

[Raymond]

From the camera angle we can't see if there is contact from B24 and how severe the contact is if there is any.

[Zoochy]

Why does the Trail official have a White whistle?
Calling Official has his arm pointing @ 45 degrees (at best)

8^)

[Stat-Man]

Originally Posted by Raymond

White is losing, calling a delay benefits them, not the throw-in team.

As, yes. 9.2.10.A. Good catch.