Legal Guarding Position

[BigT]

I have two questions.

If the falling back defender completes his avoidance and is now on the ground and the offensive player is going to wreck his knee stepping on him or steps on him is it a block?

When is the defense too late to take a charge? After he picks up his dribble or when it is too late for him to reasonably avoid the defender who has set up LGP?

[Pantherdreams]

Originally Posted by BigT

When is the defense too late to take a charge? After he picks up his dribble or when it is too late for him to reasonably avoid the defender who has set up LGP?

Defense is too late to take a charge if they cannot meet guidelines for establishing LGP.

Dribbler is not entitled to time and space so in theory they defense could land on two feet with their chest millimeters from the driving player (assuming they landed in their own space and not the into the offensive players cylinder) get hit and have it be PC.

The shooter is a little different depending on your rule set and interps. basically LGP must be established before a certain point on an air born shooter generally either before they leave the floor or before their upward motion starts depending on your rule set. Players cannot move to maintain LGP the same way once the player is airborne.

[BillyMac]

After the initial legal guarding position is obtained:
a. The guard may have one or both feet on the playing court or be airborne,
provided he/she has inbound status.
b. The guard is not required to continue facing the opponent.
c. The guard may move laterally or obliquely to maintain position, provided it
is not toward the opponent when contact occurs.
d. The guard may raise hands or jump within his/her own vertical plane.
e. The guard may turn or duck to absorb the shock of imminent contact.

[BigCat]

Rich is right. You will get different answers. Here's what I do..,If the offensive player has such a head of steam that he's going to run defense over regardless then I will call charge. The plays that would have been nothing if he stays up I will have nothing or if it causes people to trip I will call a blocking foul.

There are things in rules I question based on how game is played and coached. As a coach and player, if I or my kid doesn't stay in for contact, falls early, then I don't expect a charge call. I don't know a single coach who will say he's entitled to fall early. That's something a rule maker came up with. That's my opinion. As the coach of the defense I'll sure take it but I don't expect it. I'm not sure who comes up with some of these rules.

And moving backward is different than falling early. Moving backward entire body goes back.

[SNIPERBBB]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Rich is right. You will get different answers. Here's what I do..,If the offensive player has such a head of steam that he's going to run defense over regardless then I will call charge. The plays that would have been nothing if he stays up I will have nothing or if it causes people to trip I will call a blocking foul.

There are things in rules I question based on how game is played and coached. As a coach and player, if I or my kid doesn't stay in for contact, falls early, then I don't expect a charge call. I don't know a single coach who will say he's entitled to fall early. That's something a rule maker came up with. That's my opinion. As the coach of the defense I'll sure take it but I don't expect it. I'm not sure who comes up with some of these rules.

And moving backward is different than falling early. Moving backward entire body goes back.

Unless you have an area where officials that wont call a charge if a kid was set and the ball handler started from the division line, any coach that teaches players to take a charge wants that call.

Natural reaction of a person about to take a hit is to either turn away or start to fall, it reduces force of contact. That's why the rule is there.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

Unless you have an area where officials that wont call a charge if a kid was set and the ball handler started from the division line, any coach that teaches players to take a charge wants that call.

Natural reaction of a person about to take a hit is to either turn away or start to fall, it reduces force of contact. That's why the rule is there.

Sorry, I just don't agree. I do not know one coach on the planet who coaches it's ok to fall early. I can live with turning away. Falling early is an entirely different animal. And I promise you it is not safer. When player takes hit he bounces away. When he falls early it's a guarantee the offense will fall on top of him. Chances good he Bounce his head off floor. Been there done that....which may very well explain my posts....

[SNIPERBBB]

I didnt say they teach to fall away early. I said its the natural reaction.

[Kansas Ref]

Originally Posted by BigCat

There are things in rules I question based on how game is played and coached. As a coach and player, if I or my kid doesn't stay in for contact, falls early, then I don't expect a charge call. I don't know a single coach who will say he's entitled to fall early. That's something a rule maker came up with. That's my opinion. As the coach of the defense I'll sure take it but I don't expect it. I'm not sure who comes up with some of these rules.

And moving backward is different than falling early. Moving backward entire body goes back.

I agree there is a distinction betw falling early and moving backwards; furthermore, no coach in his right mind would teach their defenders to "fall early"--despite the theoretical correctness of action with regard to LGP status. I addition to the high potential for head injury [which is results from A1's acceleration into a B1 that is ''pulling'' the contact] there is also the toughness factor that players must develop by conditioning themselves to contact. I agree, there are a few rules that seem as though they were 'made in a vacuum'.