Chain Reaction Foul #2

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Freddy

A1 is in the act of shooting.
B3 pushes B2 into A1 causing illegal contact with the shooter.
A1’s attempt is unsuccessful.

Q: Is the foul charged to B3 or B2?

I'd have to see your play. I suppose I could always call unsportsmanlike on B3. I'd have to see it. If it is simply B3 trying to get to the shooter and he shoves B2 trying to get by or something similar i agree with everyone else. Foul on B2.

I do think unsportsmanlike is an option but it would need to be bad. If a player fires a ball at an opponent we can penalize that so id assume if he fired a teammate through the air at opponent that could be unsportsmanlike….

[SNIPERBBB]

Originally Posted by BigCat

I'd have to see your play. I suppose I could always call unsportsmanlike on B3. I'd have to see it. If it is simply B3 trying to get to the shooter and he shoves B2 trying to get by or something similar i agree with everyone else. Foul on B2.

I do think unsportsmanlike is an option but it would need to be bad. If a player fires a ball at an opponent we can penalize that so id assume if he fired a teammate through the air at opponent that could be unsportsmanlike….

I think your really trying to stretch to get to serve T here lately.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by SNIPERBBB

I think your really trying to stretch to get to serve T here lately.

Yes he has been stretching a lot of plays lately.

No way I am calling a foul on B3. B2 should complain to B3 about this one.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Yes he has been stretching a lot of plays lately.

No way I am calling a foul on B3. B2 should complain to B3 about this one.

Peace

He has no rules support, either, but it's better to be "right."

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Rich

He has no rules support, either, but it's better to be "right."

Let me ask you this Rich, Suppose A1 is leaving ground on layup, in air. B3, total jerk, intentionally shoves B2, not a little push, not in any way an accident. Deliberately to take out A1. You know it and everyone in the gym knows it. B2 hits airborne A1 hard, takes his legs out etc. A1 goes to floor, hard.

What is your call? I told the OP i'd have to see it and it would have to be really bad..and gave a very extreme example as sniper pointed out, more as a joke because i doubt id ever see it. I used throwing the ball as an example because we've talked about using the ball to foul or throw it off player's face etc. Unsportsmanlike. In my play above i'm not going to let B3 off the hook. I think it is a non basketball, unsportsmanlike…flagrant etc. Will it ever happen? hopefully, not. But if a player's intent is clear, non basketball..unsportsmanlike etc., i'm going to penalize him. The fact that he uses one of his own players rather than the ball, his own body or a chair for that matter, doesn't change his intent. There is rules support to deal with B3. Generic unsportsmanlike etc but it is there.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Let me ask you this Rich, Suppose A1 is leaving ground on layup, in air. B3, total jerk, intentionally shoves B2, not a little push, not in any way an accident. Deliberately to take out A1. You know it and everyone in the gym knows it. B2 hits airborne A1 hard, takes his legs out etc. A1 goes to floor, hard.

What is your call? I told the OP i'd have to see it and it would have to be really bad..and gave a very extreme example as sniper pointed out, more as a joke because i doubt id ever see it. I used throwing the ball as an example because we've talked about using the ball to foul or throw it off player's face etc. Unsportsmanlike. In my play above i'm not going to let B3 off the hook. I think it is a non basketball, unsportsmanlike…flagrant etc. Will it ever happen? hopefully, not. But if a player's intent is clear, non basketball..unsportsmanlike etc., i'm going to penalize him. The fact that he uses one of his own players rather than the ball, his own body or a chair for that matter, doesn't change his intent. There is rules support to deal with B3. Generic unsportsmanlike etc but it is there.

I'm talking about calling a personal foul here. I'm also not considering the absurd example, which might warrant an "absurd" response.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Rich

I'm talking about calling a personal foul here. I'm also not considering the absurd example, which might warrant an "absurd" response.

Fair enough…thx

[VaTerp]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Let me ask you this Rich, Suppose A1 is leaving ground on layup, in air. B3, total jerk, intentionally shoves B2, not a little push, not in any way an accident. Deliberately to take out A1. You know it and everyone in the gym knows it. B2 hits airborne A1 hard, takes his legs out etc. A1 goes to floor, hard.

What is your call? I told the OP i'd have to see it and it would have to be really bad..and gave a very extreme example as sniper pointed out, more as a joke because i doubt id ever see it. I used throwing the ball as an example because we've talked about using the ball to foul or throw it off player's face etc. Unsportsmanlike. In my play above i'm not going to let B3 off the hook. I think it is a non basketball, unsportsmanlike…flagrant etc. Will it ever happen? hopefully, not. But if a player's intent is clear, non basketball..unsportsmanlike etc., i'm going to penalize him. The fact that he uses one of his own players rather than the ball, his own body or a chair for that matter, doesn't change his intent. There is rules support to deal with B3. Generic unsportsmanlike etc but it is there.

You have repeatedly used the term "unsportsmanlike."

I'd like to know what rules basis you have for referencing the play in this thread or your example as "unsportsmanlike." What exactly would you call here?

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by VaTerp

You have repeatedly used the term "unsportsmanlike."

I'd like to know what rules basis you have for referencing the play in this thread or your example as "unsportsmanlike." What exactly would you call here?

If A1 has the ball for the throw in and throws the ball off of B1s face and you deem it unsporting as opposed to accidental, (See 10.4.6 sit B) what are you going to call and rule to cite?

I won't speak to the OP because as I said, id have to see it. I said unsporting is always an option. I should have said it is always a consideration. It has to be bad and deliberate to call it that. In my play, which is non basketball, deliberate etc I would call a Flagrant T and toss him. If we say it can't be a flagrant personal because there was no contact between B3 and A1 (which I agree with) then it becomes a Flagrant T. We are calling it by definition "non contact" and we decided it was unacceptable behavior.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Rich

He has no rules support, either, but it's better to be "right."

Yep. But I cannot talk about that as I seem to get into a lot of trouble. I guess there is a little "patch" on my arm that kind of tells me I must know what I am doing ultimately.

But hey, call a T and then go around defending that silly ruling.

Peace

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

But hey, call a T and then go around defending that silly ruling.

Peace

It would be silly if the circumstances werent egregious, bad,blatant. As silly as saying a defender has a right to stand in front of the inbounder...etc.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BigCat

It would be silly if the circumstances werent
egregious, bad,blatant.

OK.

Originally Posted by BigCat

As silly as saying a defender has a right to stand in front of the inbounder...etc.

BTW, I guess you need to take this up with Rule 7-6-5. Might want to also look at 7.6.5 as well.

Now there is no support for you to give a T to a player that contacts a teammate that contacts and opponent. You either call the foul on that player (which is proper), but you cannot call a T for that unless you have a case play or some interpretation to take it that far. Now I showed rules support for my comments, where is your rules support?

Peace