The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #16 (permalink)  
Old Sun May 22, 2016, 11:26pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,887
Quote:
Originally Posted by AremRed View Post
I'd encourage him to work it to get used to the USA style of ball.
Fair. I'd encourage him to find high school leagues with real coaches that will actually pay you a decent amount.
Reply With Quote
  #17 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 23, 2016, 01:02pm
Dad Dad is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 849
Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
Fair. I'd encourage him to find high school leagues with real coaches that will actually pay you a decent amount.
This.

While there is definitely a reason behind taking games which make you wonder what the point of life is, it's better to know exactly what you're getting into before you do it.

When you first start it's way better to take those $90 double header middle school games. Given you haven't just started, find some decent HS leagues like SC said. There's no reason to get assaulted -- yet.
Reply With Quote
  #18 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 23, 2016, 02:16pm
Courageous When Prudent
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hampton Roads, VA
Posts: 13,933
Next Level Referee Training, Villanova, June 24-25.

Sent from my SM-N920P using Tapatalk
__________________
A-hole formerly known as BNR
Reply With Quote
  #19 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 23, 2016, 04:33pm
certified Hot Mom tester
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: only in my own mind, such as it is
Posts: 12,918
Post

Don't forget that if you're going to referee here in the U.S., you must always follow the first rule of officiating - no exceptions.
__________________
Yom HaShoah
Reply With Quote
  #20 (permalink)  
Old Mon May 23, 2016, 11:27pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Illinois
Posts: 846
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Padgett View Post
Don't forget that if you're going to referee here in the U.S., you must always follow the first rule of officiating - no exceptions.
It's been a while since I've seen a reference to the (golden) first rule.
Reply With Quote
  #21 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 24, 2016, 01:38pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: Kansas
Posts: 563
oh and one final thing of warning: you will have to get used to having your personal "social security number" listed on the paperwork of all the gyms/school districts that you work in--yes some woman who is usally the "assistant to the assistant athletic director" will need your ssn so get comfortable issuing around your ssn to various folks all around the city/state--it took me a whole season to get used to this and I'm still leery of it.
Reply With Quote
  #22 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 24, 2016, 03:00pm
Show up, keep up, shut up
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,570
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Padgett View Post
Don't forget that if you're going to referee here in the U.S., you must always follow the first rule of officiating - no exceptions.
Isn't the first rule of officiating taught all over the world already??
Reply With Quote
  #23 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 24, 2016, 05:48pm
Official Fiveum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Eurasia - no, Myasia
Posts: 302
Also get used to there being large rule differences in the levels of U.S. basketball. If you ever make it all the way up to the NBE (National Basketball Entertainment), there's no violation for traveling or carrying.
__________________
I don't know what "signature" means.
Reply With Quote
  #24 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 24, 2016, 05:59pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: In the offseason.
Posts: 12,067
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kansas Ref View Post
oh and one final thing of warning: you will have to get used to having your personal "social security number" listed on the paperwork of all the gyms/school districts that you work in--yes some woman who is usually the "assistant to the assistant athletic director" will need your ssn so get comfortable issuing around your ssn to various folks all around the city/state--it took me a whole season to get used to this and I'm still leery of it.
Depends on where.....none of the schools I work at have my SSN. One of the benefits of an association that handles the pay for games on behalf of the schools. Only they need to know the SSN....one place.

And for those that must pass out your SSN to work games, get a TIN instead. Use it instead of your SSN. The IRS will know the mapping of that TIN to your SSN for the purposes of taxes but you get to keep your SSN secure.
__________________
Owner/Developer of RefTown.com

Last edited by Camron Rust; Tue May 24, 2016 at 06:01pm.
Reply With Quote
  #25 (permalink)  
Old Tue May 24, 2016, 11:43pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Illinois
Posts: 846
Quote:
Originally Posted by Camron Rust View Post
Depends on where.....none of the schools I work at have my SSN. One of the benefits of an association that handles the pay for games on behalf of the schools. Only they need to know the SSN....one place.
Jealous.

Where I work, I visit a bunch of different school districts. For the two that I work in for about half of my games, after the first time I've worked in that district that school year, I just write "On File" when the voucher asks for my SSN.

Some schools around here have begun to use an automated pay system, but I kinda like opening up the checks I get in the mail. Also having the paper trail helps with my personal accounting.
Reply With Quote
  #26 (permalink)  
Old Thu May 26, 2016, 10:01am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10
Thank you all guys for all your useful responses!

I have another question: Is it possible to referee games for free voluntarily and have some kind of proof of that?

I am asking this because I am coming to the US with a F-1 student visa which does not allow off-campus employment unless related to the course of studies (in my case it is not related at all), and non-paid refereeing activity may not be considered as employment, and hence I may have some chance of doing that.

Do you have any experience to share?

Thank you all!
Reply With Quote
  #27 (permalink)  
Old Thu May 26, 2016, 05:58pm
certified Hot Mom tester
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: only in my own mind, such as it is
Posts: 12,918
That's pretty simple. Work all the games you can, and tell them to send me the check.
__________________
Yom HaShoah
Reply With Quote
  #28 (permalink)  
Old Thu May 26, 2016, 06:14pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,887
Quote:
Originally Posted by italian_referee View Post
Thank you all guys for all your useful responses!

I have another question: Is it possible to referee games for free voluntarily and have some kind of proof of that?

I am asking this because I am coming to the US with a F-1 student visa which does not allow off-campus employment unless related to the course of studies (in my case it is not related at all), and non-paid refereeing activity may not be considered as employment, and hence I may have some chance of doing that.

Do you have any experience to share?

Thank you all!
Non-professional referees in America are almost always independent contractors, which are not employees, so I doubt working games would not be permitted.
Reply With Quote
  #29 (permalink)  
Old Thu May 26, 2016, 06:44pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Official View Post
Non-professional referees in America are almost always independent contractors, which are not employees, so I doubt working games would not be permitted.
Yes, that is what I thought, but rules are really strict in this sense. If you have a student visa, you cannot work apart from very specific circumstances.

On the university website there is the following definition of employment: it is considered employment any type of work performed or services provided in exchange for money, tuition, fees, books, supplies, room, food or any other benefit. An unpaid position where the work performed receives no pay or other benefit is instead considered as volunteer work and it would be fine! It also specifies that "even if you are not receiving any form of compensation for services provided, the activity may still be considered unauthorized employment."

Hence, the basic rule, as far as I understood, is: if you get money, it is considered employment. I would have some chances that officiating were not deemed as employment if I did not receive any money, and that is why I asked if it is possible to officiate games without being paid and having it on paper.

Unfortunately I am afraid that this is a serious issue...

Last edited by italian_referee; Thu May 26, 2016 at 06:47pm.
Reply With Quote
  #30 (permalink)  
Old Thu May 26, 2016, 08:35pm
LRZ LRZ is offline
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: SE PA
Posts: 766
Knowing something about the Philadelphia region, my guess--and that is all it is, speculation--is that you would have difficulty navigating the local scholastic bureaucracies to work school ball without getting paid. Rec leagues, possibly. If nothing else, there will likely be intramurals at the university. Where will you be? Temple? Penn? Villanova?

Last edited by LRZ; Thu May 26, 2016 at 08:38pm.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Breakaway Neck Referee Lanyard or NBA Style Noose Referee Lanyard? brainbrian Basketball 20 Wed Nov 21, 2012 04:28pm
Looking for referee I.D.s Rod Cannon Soccer 0 Wed Mar 18, 2009 05:50am
NBA Referee MOofficial Basketball 23 Sat Aug 04, 2007 05:42pm
NBA Referee brandan89 Basketball 11 Mon Jan 31, 2005 01:47pm
Becoming a referee John F. Basketball 5 Fri Dec 01, 2000 12:51pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:43am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1