FT Violations

[Adam]

I like the idea of having the door closed both ways, but I also agree that there's really no advantage to be gained. It's only hard to call if you're the only one calling it. It's not hard to see, IMO.

[UNIgiantslayers]

Originally Posted by BigCat

I underestimated the amount of damage the UNI loss could cause…

The FTer should be allowed to leave the semi-circle….That made me chuckle

I haven't watched a game in over a week. It's been rough, especially with the amount of trash I talked to my students prior to that weekend's games. I had no idea I have so many fans of A&M in my room on a daily basis.

I'm glad you see the ridiculousness of that argument. I'm just saying that freedom/restrictions should be all-encompassing, so I have no problem with the rule.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

I haven't watched a game in over a week. It's been rough, especially with the amount of trash I talked to my students prior to that weekend's games. I had no idea I have so many fans of A&M in my room on a daily basis.

I'm glad you see the ridiculousness of that argument. I'm just saying that freedom/restrictions should be all-encompassing, so I have no problem with the rule.

I didn't have the rule come up this year. I don't mind it though because i've seen kids cross the FT line in the past and the shooter may step back quick etc to avoid contact. No contact so no foul. FT shooter shouldn't have to worry about knees when following through etc. The violation provides a penalty even though shooter avoided the contact. I also don't mind the double penalty when there is contact--violation and foul. As BNR stated, not necessary to back into FT shooter. Other players entering lane on release make it less likely FT shooter will get rebound unless he leaves early.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Adam

I like the idea of having the door closed both ways, but I also agree that there's really no advantage to be gained. It's only hard to call if you're the only one calling it. It's not hard to see, IMO.

I think it is hard for the C to see. As soon as the ball is released, C need to move his/her eyes to the rebounding action.

I'd prefer to give this call to T

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

So you think that the player defending a throw in should be allowed to cross the end line prior to the ball being released? I realize this is not a perfect comparison, but if you restrict one player to an area, the other players should not be allowed into that area until restricted player has the freedom to avoid the player entering that area. If the players are allowed to enter that area, then the free thrower should be allowed to leave the semi circle to avoid a player trying to box them out on a long rebound.

The free throw shooter has released the ball so it's not the same as defending a throw-in. You have listed no advantage of crossing the free throw line other than the free-throw shooter doesn't get to do the same. Like I said, all the defender is going to do is cause illegal contact if he crosses the free throw line so what is the advantage?

And again I'm concerned about the officiating aspect which you are not addressing. Having to a call a violation followed by foul is very convoluted. Let's just call the foul and move on with the game.

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

[Adam]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

I think it is hard for the C to see. As soon as the ball is released, C need to move his/her eyes to the rebounding action.

I'd prefer to give this call to T

Fair point, but we have to watch the shooter anyway for the same violation.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

I haven't watched a game in over a week. It's been rough, especially with the amount of trash I talked to my students prior to that weekend's games. I had no idea I have so many fans of A&M in my room on a daily basis.

I'm glad you see the ridiculousness of that argument. I'm just saying that freedom/restrictions should be all-encompassing, so I have no problem with the rule.

I have no problem with the college rule. And in eight years of officiating college basketball under the same rule, minus the restriction of crossing the free throw line by the defender, it has never been a problem because it is stupid to cross the free throw line if you are the defender; all you're going to do is contact the free-throw shooter illegally.

College players stand in front of the free-throw shooter after they release the ball and box out. Any contact when doing it that way is caused by the free-throw shooter.

Again I don't care about the fairness or the equity of this rule. I only care about the rules in that regard when it comes to correctable errors, because those are our fault.

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

[UNIgiantslayers]

I guess we agree that we disagree.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

I guess we agree that we disagree.

Still waiting for someone to tell me what advantage is gained by a defender crossing the free-throw line. Since I can't fathom it in my mind I need somebody to tell me what it could be.

I can't even imagine how a defender does it without contacting the free-throw shooter.

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Still waiting for someone to tell me what advantage is gained by a defender crossing the free-throw line. Since I can't fathom it in my mind I need somebody to tell me what it could be.

I can't even imagine how a defender does it without contacting the free-throw shooter.

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

Good Lord, are you changing your name to Nevadaref( joke Nevada)? The advantage is that if I'm shooting FTs and you come at my knees I'm going to back away before contact..when I should be allowed to follow through and stay there. No contact so no foul but has impact./advantage on other throws. It doesn't happen in NCAAM or Higher level boys high school but I can see where it's an issue other places.

[JeffM]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

Still waiting for someone to tell me what advantage is gained by a defender crossing the free-throw line. Since I can't fathom it in my mind I need somebody to tell me what it could be.

I can't even imagine how a defender does it without contacting the free-throw shooter.

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

When players are taught to box out, they are taught to make contact with the player who they are boxing out. Crossing the free throw line enables them to make contact. The only real benefit in doing this before the ball hits the rim is perhaps their coach will notice how well they box out and maybe they'll get more playing time.

Unless it is during a box-out drill, free-throw shooters rarely make much of an effort to avoid being boxed out and don't make an effort to get the ball until it is clear that it was a miss. (Everyone who shoots a free throw should expect to make it and usually will.)

I used to see this type of contact in Girls MS games and possibly even Girls Freshman/JV games. It always looked odd to me.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by JeffM

(Everyone who shoots a free throw should expect to make it and usually will.)

Third chuckle today. Kids can't shoot FTs today. All my posts are made with smile. Not meaning to be an ass.

Ps. Chuckling 3 times in one day is special because 4 out of 5 days I work w my wife...

[Raymond]

HS & MS coaches need to ask college coaches why they don't teach their players to initiate contact with the free throw shooter.

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Good Lord, are you changing your name to Nevadaref( joke Nevada)? The advantage is that if I'm shooting FTs and you come at my knees I'm going to back away before contact..when I should be allowed to follow through and stay there. No contact so no foul but has impact./advantage on other throws. It doesn't happen in NCAAM or Higher level boys high school but I can see where it's an issue other places.

Never happened in my eight years of officiating college basketball where there is no restriction across the free throw line. And never happened in all my years of playing basketball either. Where do you guys come up with this stuff? If it's such an advantage how come college coaches don't teach their players to do it?

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BigCat

Good Lord, are you changing your name to Nevadaref( joke Nevada)? The advantage is that if I'm shooting FTs and you come at my knees I'm going to back away before contact..when I should be allowed to follow through and stay there. No contact so no foul but has impact./advantage on other throws. It doesn't happen in NCAAM or Higher level boys high school but I can see where it's an issue other places.

It's not an issue if officials do something called blowing their whistle and calling a foul instead of being so lackadaisical during free throws.

"Coach, if your player knocks the shooter backwards or makes contact to his knees I'm calling a foul."

Sent from my SPH-L900 using Tapatalk