The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Basketball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 12:25am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 678
Too many quarters

During the intermission between the 3rd and 4th quarter, team A forgets to send a sub to the table in time to replace A6, who has reached the state limit on quarters played. While we don't care about the quarter limit, the team obviously does, and my question is: is there any rules justification for getting the sub in the game in exchange for a tech? My common sense says there is something they could do here, because the technical is obviously less of a penalty than an eventual forfeit.
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 12:28am
Rich's Avatar
Get away from me, Steve.
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 15,770
They can call a timeout, right?
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 01:01am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 678
They were out, but even taking an excessive would be better. Wow, can't believe I didn't think of that earlier. For the record, not my game, but rather my home town team was the visitor, and the the home team ended up not doing anything and had to forfeit the game this morning.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 02:07am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Illinois
Posts: 1,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by frezer11 View Post
They were out, but even taking an excessive would be better. Wow, can't believe I didn't think of that earlier. For the record, not my game, but rather my home town team was the visitor, and the the home team ended up not doing anything and had to forfeit the game this morning.
Maybe, the officials could have said by conference/state rules(whatever) A1 is no longer eligible to participate and a sub is required. Even after the first horn....just a thought.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 06:29am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 388
Ideas...

In the spirit of the game--if B HC is not pitching a fit--just wave the kid in and play ball.

What about an argument along the lines of telling B HC that the table just now informed us all that A6 is about to play his/her 6th quarter and, based upon that (new) knowledge, we have to sub him/her out. Thinking along the lines of letting a kid play with 5 fouls for a minute because the table failed to let us know...we wouldn't penalize this, just immediately get the kid out of the game after we're made aware.

Worst case, if you have any chance of pulling it off successfully, can you step up and (wink, wink) say you saw the kid on the way to the table before the horn went off?
__________________
Dan R.

Last edited by Danvrapp; Sat Feb 13, 2016 at 08:18am.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 07:27am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: SE Ohio
Posts: 1,198
This obviously varies by state but here ohio says1.9) Penalty for participation in more than five (5) quarters per day:
• When discovered during a contest, the team shall be assessed a technical foul by the
official and the student shall be disqualified from the game. All quarters played shall
count toward the maximum permitted.
• When discovered after a contest is completed, there is no team or individual penalty
but all quarters played by the individual shall count toward the maximum permitted
for the player.
1.10) Length of quarters:
a. Varsity — 8 minute quarters.:
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 08:06am
High Five Master
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 669
Yowza. No game penalty in Missouri for this, it's taken care of at state. A forfeit seems pretty harsh. Especially in the OP since the kid tried to get replaced. That sucks
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 10:18am
Rich's Avatar
Get away from me, Steve.
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 15,770
I know I suggested a timeout, but I'd allow the sub.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 10:26am
Adam's Avatar
Keeper of the HAMMER
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: MST
Posts: 27,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich View Post
I know I suggested a timeout, but I'd allow the sub.
As would I.

"Coach, you're saying #25 is no longer eligible? I need a sub, then."
__________________
Sprinkles are for winners.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 10:46am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Posts: 14,995
I officiate by the NFHS rules book. I don't care about any restrictions that are particular to a league/conference about playing quarters. That is not my concern. The coaches and ADs can worry about that stuff. I'm not bending the substitution rules to accommodate them. If they encounter a problem they can take a time-out to prevent a player participating.

Officials shouldn't have to worry about such things. They are outside of our purview.
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 11:02am
NFHS Official
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,734
Next time they have the ball, just stop play and get the sub in.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 11:04am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 18,016
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post

Officials shouldn't have to worry about such things. They are outside of our purview.
Except that in some places, they do have to worry because they are in the rules.

In the OP, I'd ask the state (if they haven't already addressed it) how to deal with it.

We see similar items reasonably frequently in baseball where "local rules" are added without considering how the umpire should enforce them.

Local rules are made by fools.
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 11:24am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 678
From what I understand, the officials were made aware of the situation after the fact by a team B assistant who was keeping the book, who apparently also did the JV game. The home team didn't say anything about why they needed a sub. I think I would've tried to let the sub in if I knew what the deal was, but if the opposing coach was aware and/or upset, then I'm making the home team take a TO. Never seen a score of 2-0 reported until now!
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 11:29am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Wyoming
Posts: 678
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueDevilRef View Post
Yowza. No game penalty in Missouri for this, it's taken care of at state. A forfeit seems pretty harsh. Especially in the OP since the kid tried to get replaced. That sucks
It is a bit harsh, but at the same time, this is one of those things that assistants CAN'T allow to happen. Someone has to keep watch of these things, everyone knows about the quarter limit. And at the end of the day, whether it's for grades or quarters or whatever, if an ineligible player plays, it's a forfeit
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Sat Feb 13, 2016, 11:49am
Rich's Avatar
Get away from me, Steve.
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 15,770
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref View Post
I officiate by the NFHS rules book. I don't care about any restrictions that are particular to a league/conference about playing quarters. That is not my concern. The coaches and ADs can worry about that stuff. I'm not bending the substitution rules to accommodate them. If they encounter a problem they can take a time-out to prevent a player participating.

Officials shouldn't have to worry about such things. They are outside of our purview.
I officiate on a basketball court in the real world. Not on an Internet forum and not inside a rules book.

I know these rules quite well because I'm a conference commissioner and I handle waivers that teams request (smaller programs can get a waiver for players to play in a 3rd half per night). I get that not every official is going to be versed in these rules, but I can't help that. That night, my concern is the game in front of me.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Seven Quarters riverfalls57 Basketball 16 Thu Feb 23, 2012 03:08pm
Between quarters hawk65 Basketball 10 Wed Dec 19, 2007 03:38pm
Too many quarters moref Basketball 7 Mon Jan 22, 2007 12:58am
too many quarters johnfox Basketball 4 Thu Dec 06, 2001 02:30pm
"T" between quarters sharkref Basketball 4 Wed Jan 26, 2000 01:55am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:31am.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1