When to call the Technical

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

A technical foul for going to the men's room? That's rather harsh, don't you think?

Originally Posted by bballref3966

Did you charge this T to the player? Because then not only do I strongly disagree with giving a T at all in this instance, but you misapplied the rule as well.

NFHS 10-5-5: “The head coach shall not permit team members to leave the bench area and/or playing court for an unauthorized reason.”

This is the only rule reference that justifies a T here, and if you're going to go there, you have to charge it to the head coach. Or you can just not go there at all...going to the locker room is an authorized reason to leave the bench.

Originally Posted by BillyMac

... he's not a player, he's bench personnel. He was disqualified with five fouls.

Originally Posted by JetMetFan

To add to the other comments: Before handing out the technical did you know whether the HC told the player to go to the locker room or whether the player asked and was given permission by his HC?

Sometimes it's better to leave well enough alone.

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Leaving that one alone short of an overt show of unsportsmanlike behavior.

I agree. While disqualified players are to remain on the bench so as to be under the supervision of their coach, there may be a valid reason for the player leaving. A case in point: The OhioHSAA allows players to play five quarters per day, i.e., in a FR/JV/VAR tripleheader a player may play one QT in the FR game, one quarter in the JV game, and then still be eligible to play in three QTs in the VAR game. Therefore, a player who has fouled out in the 4th QT of the JV after playing three QTs still has two QTs of eligibility for the VAR game and the JV HC is sending that player to the locker room to be with the VAR players and VAR HC.

MTD, Sr.


P.S. Billy: Last year Mark, Jr., and I had a girls' JV game the ended up going three () OTs (don't tell Padgett). At my age I always (with apologies to the late J. Dallas Shirley) use the rest room for a #1 just before we leave the locker room before the game. I then use the rest room again at HT. For this particular game I did not avail myself of the rest room at HT. During a TO with literally seconds left to go in the 2nd OT, I tell Junior that if this game goes to a 3rd OT, there will be a delay to the start of the 3rd OT. Sure enough, V1 scores a layup at the buzzer to tie the game. When I got back on the court, Mark told me that both teams were going to shoot 2 FTs because he had charged me with a delay of game TF, .

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

If you want to die on that hill, go ahead. You're not incorrect in your assessment. But I'll pick my battles and leave well-enough alone on this one. I've always heard guys say "don't go searching for T's, they'll find you." I think in this case, you're hunting for one.

If someone takes the jersey off right in the gym, the T has found you. Only pure disinterest in applying the rules gets you out of calling that one. Sometimes you can't save players from their own stupidity.

What are you going to say to the opposing coach when he confronts you with not calling the blatantly obvious technical?

[UNIgiantslayers]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

If someone takes the jersey off right in the gym, the T has found you. Only pure disinterest in applying the rules gets you out of calling that one. Sometimes you can't save players from their own stupidity.

What are you going to say to the opposing coach when he confronts you with not calling the blatantly obvious technical?

I was talking about the T for leaving the bench anyway, but with regard to the jersey I'm going to say something to the tune of "I didn't see it, coach. I was focused on the action on the court," if I happen to be in that situation

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

I was talking about the T for leaving the bench anyway, but with regard to the jersey I'm going to say something to the tune of "I didn't see it, coach. I was focused on the action on the court," if I happen to be in that situation

Every time I've seen this happen, it's literally been a player 3 feet in front of the referee during a dead ball to deal with the blood on the jersey. Good luck with that excuse.

[UNIgiantslayers]

...and as somebody mentioned, a bit of preventative officiating (i.e. "hey coach, make sure he does that in the locker room") will avoid that whole situation.

[Jesse James]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Why not simply give the coach a quiet reminder before the kid takes off the shirt?

In a high school Xmas tournament I watched, a kid played the first quarter with a white t-shirt under a blue jersey. At the quarter break, an official told him the T-shirt needed to go. So the kid removes both shirts at the bench--with no repercussion. From the fourth row, it was pick and choose deluxe.

As you say, it's so easy to help yourself in this one with a quick "and change outside of court view"

[Adam]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Why not simply give the coach a quiet reminder before the kid takes off the shirt?

I'm not even quiet about it.

"Coach, keep me out of trouble and send him out of the gym where I can't see him to change his shirt."

Stupid rule, but pretty damned clear cut.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

I was talking about the T for leaving the bench anyway, but with regard to the jersey I'm going to say something to the tune of "I didn't see it, coach. I was focused on the action on the court," if I happen to be in that situation

Don't put your creditability and integrity in jeopardy.

Advise the coach, then if they don't comply and you have to call it, they'll know why.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by Adam

I'm not even quiet about it.

"Coach, keep me out of trouble and send him out of the gym where I can't see him to change his shirt."

Stupid rule, but pretty damned clear cut.

I think Title IX forced that rule upon us.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by BadNewsRef

I think Title IX forced that rule upon us.

You are probably right, but the Title IX beneficiaries are the worst offenders sometimes.

OTOH, it was well established law when I was in school, and I don't remember the girls walking around with just their sports bras on.

I'm pretty sure I'd remember that.

[deecee]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

...and as somebody mentioned, a bit of preventative officiating (i.e. "hey coach, make sure he does that in the locker room") will avoid that whole situation.

Yup. Couple times a player starts to take the jersey off I stop him and tell him to do it in the hallway and away from the gym.

[Smitty]

Originally Posted by Adam

You are probably right, but the Title IX beneficiaries are the worst offenders sometimes.

Worked a holiday tourney earlier this year with one of the girl's national teams from Australia. During warmups we noticed that both teams were wearing their white jerseys, and only the Australia uniforms were their dark on the other side, so they offered to change. Every girl just went behind the bench, which was where the majority of the fans were sitting, and stripped off both their shirts and shorts to turn them around (all had some for of spandex underneath, you pervs). My partner and I were in our pre-game spots across from the benches and every single pair of male eyes were focused on the Australia bench. It was pretty funny to see all heads turned that way. They are a little less prudish down under, apparently.

[Dad]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Why not simply give the coach a quiet reminder before the kid takes off the shirt?

Because I have a 100% chance to forget if I'm not the one closest to the coach. If I'm there I'll hopefully remember to say something. If not, then I'm not going looking for a T.

Sometimes the players give you no choice but to call a T.

[UNIgiantslayers]

Originally Posted by Adam

Don't put your creditability and integrity in jeopardy.

Advise the coach, then if they don't comply and you have to call it, they'll know why.

That's a fair point, but I tend to not pay attention to the bench unless they give me reason to.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by UNIgiantslayers

That's a fair point, but I tend to not pay attention to the bench unless they give me reason to.

If the crew sends a player off to change a jersey (or whatever), then it is the crew's responsibility to monitor the situation. When the notification is made to make the uniform adjustment a caveat needs to accompany it, "please make sure your player leaves the visible confines of the gym." "I don't pay attention to the bench" is not acceptable in this situation.