Redux

[Bad Zebra]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Too early to close that thread. If you want to say I'm a fanboy, sure but too many of you are refboys who feel the need to always defend refs from the likes of Jay Bilas who you know may actually be right once in a while...

Dude. You seem to be operating under the mistaken notion that this forum is some kind of public space protected by the First Amendment. Newsflash: It is a commercial internet venture that operates at the pleasure of and with the financial support of the owners.

It's purpose is pretty clear. The terms and conditions of use, while not explicitly spelled out everywhere, are pretty generous and broad.

You have no basis to decide when a thread should be closed. You have no place calling anybody who posts here a "refboy", whatever the hell that is.

Your posts serve no purpose other than to contradict the legitimate posters and fly in the face of the stated purpose of the site. I think the moderators and site owner are being too lenient with you. Your posts are more "troll" than anything else. Either get with the program, or just go away.

[The_Rookie]

Ducky...All you want is attention and to make outlandish and stupid comments to get it. This is a site to exchange ideas and information so that collectively we can all get better at being basketball Refs!

In no way do you make any worthwhile contribution to this site.

To quote my pal Fred G. Sanford...."You are a fool"

[BlueDevilRef]

And you keep saying in my games, I don't believe for any amount of time that you are one of us. Trolls like you can make things fun for a bit but you have worn out your welcome. Just go away.


I wish I had a cool signature

[Mark Padgett]

[Kelvin green]

Originally Posted by mutantducky

Too early to close that thread. If you want to say I'm a fanboy, sure but too many of you are refboys who feel the need to always defend refs from the likes of Jay Bilas who you know may actually be right once in a while. Ok that's not true, he's right only on Tuesdays. But sometimes games are poorly officiated and the one I saw last night was. Again, there have been some very good games going on that I have seen on TV and full props to the refs. The star player on the team I was rooting for fouled out which he rarely does and I have never seen him get angry like he did and the coach was holding him back from going at a ref. This is basically like a Tim Duncan or Dirk N type player who rarely goes after refs. I think there were 6 fouls called in the first 5 minutes on the team I was rotting for in the second half and then bonus a few minutes after. The double digit lead gone. Teams have to change how they play and it messes up how they want to play. Fans don't want to see a FT shooting contest. The other games I saw played and some were losses the games were officiated just fine. There is going to be variations in consistency but this was way off the median.

It was an internet broadcast with the commentators for the opposing school.
This was a play that occurred
Ball goes into the post. Whistle blows. Me- "Oh come on, that was ticky-tack" Commentator- "must have got him for the arm bar in the post" Offensive post player goes to the FT line. But wait, it turns out the center or the trail blew the whistle. It was an off-ball foul. Refs huddle, confusion over who to put on the line (that can happen, not blaming them for that) foul is called on one of the guards. Replay- "commentator people, "not sure where the foul was, I guess he put his hands on him" That's the home team commentators questioning the call. There wasn't a foul. When a defender off ball is guarding someone close, and the offensive player makes a cut or goes around the 3 point line which was the case here, there may be the slightest bit of contact. If it is a hold or impeding of movement then sure make the call. But there were fouls called when the offensive player jabs a bit into the defensive player, some contact and the refs mistakenly think there is a freedom of movement restriction. Watch the whole play and learn to ignore those calls when the offensive player is not restricted. I don't see these fouls called at the bigger stage. It's bad for TV and it's bad for everyone involved in the game if they are. The way the game was being called, ridiculous "over the back" calls, fouls whenever someone drove the lane. How can you play defense with refs calling it that way? I honestly believe some refs don't know what incidental contact means despite officiating for years. I know it can be a hard call, but far too many refs blow the whistle whenever there is a drive. If the offensive player jumps up, bodies contort, some contact usually made by the offensive player making the the drive to the basket, these refs blow the whistle despite the defender making in what my opinion was a perfectly natural defensive play. No contact on the arms, just a bit of body contact. Again, the team I was rooting for got these calls and I thought some of them were bad calls. I don't see those calls done at the same frequency for the top 25 TV games.


And to any new refs- on the push/over the back call. If someone in position gets the board it is ok to ignore a bit of contact in the back. Maybe the other player's arm reaches over, maybe there bodies' hit a bit. If it rises to a level where there was too much contact call the foul, or where it will allow the ball to get tipped away then sure call it. But for F's sake, you don't need to always blow the whistle just because there was a bit of contact.

So here is what I propose. We start playing the mutantducky games. These are the rules.

1) the first person that responds to the post. Declares with a one word title "delusional"
2) in the body of the post, we write "this fanboy is delusional"
3) the 2nd person who posts then validates the first person's call. The first person is awarded the mutant gold. Validation is done by quoting...
4) the 3rd person who then posts, validates #2 post Awards the silver. #3 also request the thread be closed which awards the bronze...

[Dad]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

So here is what I propose. We start playing the mutantducky games. These are the rules.

1) the first person that responds to the post. Declares with a one word title "delusional"
2) in the body of the post, we write "this fanboy is delusional"
3) the 2nd person who posts then validates the first person's call. The first person is awarded the mutant gold. Validation is done by quoting...
4) the 3rd person who then posts, validates #2 post Awards the silver. #3 also request the thread be closed which awards the bronze...

I like my game better.

Rule 1: Ban.

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by Mark Padgett

There's no such call as "over the back".

Originally Posted by AremRed

Sure there is, it's just not a rule book term.

Sadly, I'v heard it verbalized and seen it signaled in a HS tournament JV game in the last month . . . that game was a bit of an adventure in refereeing . . .

(Yes, I'm a realist and know that most of the JV refs are either newish and trying to learn to work their way up or the folk who don't care enough to work their way up . . I *really* prefer the former, even when they are missing calls . . .)

[Dad]

Originally Posted by so cal lurker

Sadly, I'v heard it verbalized and seen it signaled in a HS tournament JV game in the last month . . . that game was a bit of an adventure in refereeing . . .

(Yes, I'm a realist and know that most of the JV refs are either newish and trying to learn to work their way up or the folk who don't care enough to work their way up . . I *really* prefer the former, even when they are missing calls . . .)

What is the signal for over the back?

[Mark Padgett]

Originally Posted by Dad

What is the signal for over the back?

[Altor]

The typical "signal" is affectionately known as the "Frankenstein" signal. You won't find it in the book. That was part of lurker's point.

[Dad]

Originally Posted by Altor

The typical "signal" is affectionately known as the "Frankenstein" signal. You won't find it in the book. That was part of lurker's point.

Mark Padgett had what I was looking for. I was just curious what signal they tried to make up on the fly.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Dad

Mark Padgett had what I was looking for. I was just curious what signal they tried to make up on the fly.

And I'm sure you knew exactly what it looked like. We've all seen other officials give it, and we all cringe when we see it.

[so cal lurker]

Originally Posted by Altor

The typical "signal" is affectionately known as the "Frankenstein" signal. You won't find it in the book. That was part of lurker's point.

Precisely. Far, far too common in middle school games my son played . . . I had thought he'd be past that now that he's in HS. . . but as I've told him several times, just roll with the refs -- and work harder to make varsity to get the better ones!

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Adam

And I'm sure you knew exactly what it looked like. We've all seen other officials give it, and we all cringe when we see it.

I laugh when I see it, actually. The Creeping Death foul.

I've seen some give it with 1 arm. I laugh twice as loud.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Altor

The typical "signal" is affectionately known as the "Frankenstein" signal.