IAABO OOB mechanics

[constable]

I was reading through the IAABO 2 person manual. It says that if the ball goes OOB above the FTE on the lead's sideline, the trail while working the arc, is responsible for the OBB call.

How ridiculous is this? My local board doesn't employ this logic. Does anyone other IAABO board use it?

I don't work IAABO but this does make sense to an extent that Lead might be watching his primary area and not see who touched the ball. I was working 2 person one time after doing a lot of 3 in the months before that and was so focused on my matchup that I didn't even see that the ball had gone OOB on my sideline. No whistle from me so my P had blown for me.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by AremRed

I don't work IAABO but this does make sense to an extent that Lead might be watching his primary area and not see who touched the ball.

Then L can blow the whistle and ask for help -- just like if the ball goes out of bounds on the endline opposite L.

I agree T needs to be ready to help / make the call if L doesn't but *usually* it's either close (did the guard step on the line or not?) and T won't have a look at that, or it's really obvious (the ball ends up in the bleachers) and L will be able to see it even if he's not looking.

[Rich]

I've heard this thinking before. I've completely ignored it.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Mregor]

Originally Posted by Rich

I've heard this thinking before. I've completely ignored it.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

When I was there, (WIAA) almost everyone I worked with used this mechanic. It was a NASO recommendation at the time and I liked it. Now doing 2-person in AZ where everyone looks at me like I'm an alien if I suggest it, I miss it. Trail needs to move along the arc to midcourt to get proper angle if the play dictates.

Roger

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by Mregor

When I was there, (WIAA) almost everyone I worked with used this mechanic. It was a NASO recommendation at the time and I liked it. Now doing 2-person in AZ where everyone looks at me like I'm an alien if I suggest it, I miss it. Trail needs to move along the arc to midcourt to get proper angle if the play dictates.

Roger

And the trail still can't even half-way reliably see if a player steps on or dribbles on the side line or not. To see that, the trail would have to come within about 10' of the far sideline, much farther than midcourt. If they need to do that, maybe they should just do a cross-court rotation and stay over there. Or, leave the coverage of the line itself to the lead but have coverage of balls knocked out go to the trail.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

And the trail still can't even half-way reliably see if a player steps on or dribbles on the side line or not. To see that, the trail would have to come within about 10' of the far sideline, much farther than midcourt. If they need to do that, maybe they should just do a cross-court rotation and stay over there. Or, leave the coverage of the line itself to the lead but have coverage of balls knocked out go to the trail.

If I understand his comments, he is not talking about making a call on the sideline, but to move closer to the play instead of being glued to the sideline the Trail is located by. That is the exact same mechanic we recommend folks use here in our state in a 2 person game. It is not about the line, it is about the movement to show you are on-ball so the lead can concentrate on coverage in their primary.

Peace

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

If I understand his comments, he is not talking about making a call on the sideline, but to move closer to the play instead of being glued to the sideline the Trail is located by. That is the exact same mechanic we recommend folks use here in our state in a 2 person game. It is not about the line, it is about the movement to show you are on-ball so the lead can concentrate on coverage in their primary.

Peace

Agree 100% with the points on the trail moving. The trail should be doing that even if the L has the sideline.

If the point is to keep the lead from even looking up the line at (as seemed to be the point), who is covering the line? The trail can't see it and the lead isn't looking there?

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Mregor

When I was there, (WIAA) almost everyone I worked with used this mechanic. It was a NASO recommendation at the time and I liked it. Now doing 2-person in AZ where everyone looks at me like I'm an alien if I suggest it, I miss it. Trail needs to move along the arc to midcourt to get proper angle if the play dictates.

Roger

I move all I want. It's still not my line.

I've been here 14 years now. Still don't call the opposite sideline as a trail.

[stripes]

Originally Posted by constable

I was reading through the IAABO 2 person manual. It says that if the ball goes OOB above the FTE on the lead's sideline, the trail while working the arc, is responsible for the OBB call.

How ridiculous is this? My local board doesn't employ this logic. Does anyone other IAABO board use it?

In my neck of the woods, we are not IAABO, but we have used this "mechanic" for more than 20 years. More often than not, the T will have a better look at the play than the L. Especially if the ball is high and there is post play on the L's side. The L can always make the call if the L sees the OOB, but it is generally called by the T. Very easy to do.

[BryanV21]

Like Bob was saying, it doesn't make sense to me because the T has a horrible view of the opposite sideline. The L should be the 1st responsible for the OOB call, while the T steps in either for help or if the L misses the call.

I can't tell you how many times I've made OOB calls based on the ball or a player's foot barely touching the line. And in those cases, it's going to be really difficult for the official on the opposite side of the court to see that.

Look, in 2-man there are going to be missed plays, leading to complaints from coaches and others. Even in 3-man there are going to be missed plays. We can't see every inch of the court at all times.

With that said, though... when in Rome.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BryanV21

Like Bob was saying, it doesn't make sense to me because the T has a horrible view of the opposite sideline. The L should be the 1st responsible for the OOB call, while the T steps in either for help or if the L misses the call.

I can't tell you how many times I've made OOB calls based on the ball or a player's foot barely touching the line. And in those cases, it's going to be really difficult for the official on the opposite side of the court to see that.

Look, in 2-man there are going to be missed plays, leading to complaints from coaches and others. Even in 3-man there are going to be missed plays. We can't see every inch of the court at all times.

With that said, though... when in Rome.

I think the play they are talking about is when the ball is knocked OOB, not when a player steps on the line. In those cases, both are going to easily know when it goes out but it is far more likely that T will know who touched it last.

In the case of a player stepping on the line, only the L has decent view of that.

[deecee]

I make it a point in all pre-games that I will blow the whistle on ANY OOB on my lines, I just may ask for help. There is 1 exception and that's in transition with a backcourt pass that goes out on my sideline and I am moving down court. This is the only acceptable time for the T to call an OOB on L's line, mostly because my entire back may be to the play.

Frequency of occurrence: 1 per 5 years.

[JRutledge]

If it is obvious, the lead might not be watching the ball going out of bounds. Now a touching the line or ball hitting the sideline will be the lead's call, but the ball clearly going out of bounds where it hits a wall or goes into the stands, the Trail might be on ball and obviously tell who put the ball out of bounds. You have to work together. I think the Trail should blow the whistle if the ball clearly goes out of bounds, but look to the Lead for help. It is a huge flaw in the mechanics already so there is no perfect way to handle this either way.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

It is a huge flaw in the mechanics already so there is no perfect way to handle this either way.

Well said. It's the biggest problem in a two person game. It's something that always has to be pregamed, and even then, the coaches may have the best look at a player stepping on a table side sideline, certainly a much better look than the trail from over on the opposite table side.

And the lead's not even "supposed" to be looking there, it's outside of his primary. He's "supposed" to be watching the post players beating the heck out of each other.

It certainly "is a huge flaw in the mechanics" of a two person game.