Abandonment (BRD example play)

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by David Emerling

When you say "the time of the infraction", in this case, that would be the time of the appeal?

What "infraction" are you referring to?

I always believed the "time of the infraction" was simply the moment that the runner failed to do what he was supposed to do.

R1, R3, one out. Suicide squeeze. Batter bunts the ball in front of home plate. F2 fields the ball, tags the BR, then throws to second to play on R1, and the ball goes into center field. R1 misses second on his way to third. An appeal is made that the runner missed second. At the "time of the infraction", the BR was already out, so his miss of second was not a force. R3's run scores.

R1, R3, one out. Suicide squeeze. Batter bunts the ball in front of home plate. F2 fields the ball, and throws to first base. The ball goes past F3, but F9 is backing up the throw, and he throws out the BR at second. R1 goes all the way to third on the play, missing second. An appeal is made that the runner missed second. At the "time of the infraction", the BR was still viable, so R1 was still forced when he missed the bag. R3's run does not score.

Or am I wrong here? Now I'm beginning to doubt myself...

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Manny A

I always believed the "time of the infraction" was simply the moment that the runner failed to do what he was supposed to do.

R1, R3, one out. Suicide squeeze. Batter bunts the ball in front of home plate. F2 fields the ball, tags the BR, then throws to second to play on R1, and the ball goes into center field. R1 misses second on his way to third. An appeal is made that the runner missed second. At the "time of the infraction", the BR was already out, so his miss of second was not a force. R3's run scores.

R1, R3, one out. Suicide squeeze. Batter bunts the ball in front of home plate. F2 fields the ball, and throws to first base. The ball goes past F3, but F9 is backing up the throw, and he throws out the BR at second. R1 goes all the way to third on the play, missing second. An appeal is made that the runner missed second. At the "time of the infraction", the BR was still viable, so R1 was still forced when he missed the bag. R3's run does not score.

Or am I wrong here? Now I'm beginning to doubt myself...

All that seems correct to me -- if the runner was forced when he missed the base, then any subsequent appeal is a force out.

AT ONE TIME there was discussion / interp that if the runner was forced at the start of the play, then the force would be removed if the runner was put out, but NOT removed if the runner was declared out.

So, under this AT ONE TIME interp, in your first play above, if F2's throw had retired R1, then it's not a force. But when F2's throw goes wild, and R1 advances to third missing second, any subsequent appeal would be a force out.