2013 World Series Thread

[Mountaincoach]

Originally Posted by Manny A

And who made them household names? The press and the fans. You don't hear or read of other umpires bringing up their names and saying Joyce and Welke should go down in infamy. But you just might hear them say Demuth opened up a huge Pandora's Box.

True. I look at it as Demuth opened a door to change that should have happened decades ago.

Yeah, they are age-old traditions and precedents. But unless the union decided that those traditions must change for the 2013 World Series, why now? Why not at the start of the post-season? Or the start of the 2013 regular season?

It's just the right thing to do, no matter when it happens. Yep, it should have happened at the beginning of the season......about 30 or 40 years ago.

Until real change is formally put into effect (e.g., the use of instant replay), you go with what is expected of your trade, no matter how old. If what Demuth did is considered correct by those who REALLY matter (and, to me, the press and fans don't matter here; it's the fellow umpires who matter), I would really like to know.

The fans always matter, and unfortunately, the press has the fans' ear, so they have to matter too. NASCAR learned that lesson the hard way. They stopped listening to the fans and kept listening to the officials, 43 very spoiled-rotten drivers, sponsors, and owners. Now the grandstands are about half empty at every single track. Trust me--there's nobody in MLB who is going to stand at a microphone and say "The call stands because the umpires come first.

You ridicule how every close play will now get reviewed. Well, guess what? That is now the standard. Heaven help the umpire of this crew who doesn't give in to the whines of the manager. Heck, I'm guessing that the expectation is for umpires to come running in like their NFL and NBA counterparts to "help" their partner get the call right even before the manager steps out of the dugout.

First, I never said that every play would be reviewed. Secondly, the NFL and NBA officials ignore the vast majority of the whining from the coaches. And, thirdly, I thought a baseball officiating crew was supposed to be a team. In reality, the entire crew is apparently a bunch of independent contractors who reign with complete autonomy over their little patch of the field. Demuth asked for help. If the umpires felt more comfortable in asking for help, the game would actually get stronger.

Bottom line--MLB umpires do not work as a team as I feel they should. As a result, we see these massive meltdown arguments, fights, suspensions, fines every single year. But it's apparently too late for that to change now--instant replay is coming.

[PeteBooth]

IMO, you are spot on in your assessment and I will add one more comment to that. IMO, baseball officials unlike other major sports officials are not held accountable.

Ed Hochule a well respected football official blew a call BIG time in a game played between the Broncos and the Chargers years past. It was an inadvertant whistle and at that time (before the NFL changed the rule) the ball was declared dead regardless of what actually happaned.

Replay clearly showed that the runner was not down by contact etc. and the Chargers recovered the fumble but because of the inadvertant whistle the Broncos retained possession and won the game on the next play. If memory serves Hochule did not get any post season assignments that year.

MLB umpires are there for life. I'm pretty certain there are some young very good officials in the Minor leagues waiting for their shot but most will never get that chance.

Yes as baseball officials we are "viewed" as a team but we do work as individuals. That's the way it has been taught for years. MAKE YOUR OWN CALLS. I was a proponent of that philosophy 1000 percent but perhaps (im getting older now) that philosophy needs to change.

One major problem is that for the vast majority of us we work 2 person until we get to playoffs / sectionals / state finals etc. In other words out of a total sason there are only a handful of games where you actually work 3 or 4 person.

Working 2 person, it's very difficult to work as a team because you simply do not have the coverage you need. Each umpire in a way has to stick "with their own island' so to speak because as mentioned there is only 2 of you.

In summary, for MLB I do agree, they should work more as a team and with IR coming perhaps the umpiring schools will change their philosophy, but in 2 person it is more difficult.

Pete Booth