LLWS - Championship

[JJ]

This plate umpire is doing a GREAT job! Fun to watch, and a credit to his training. The game is good, too.

JJ

[RPatrino]

Originally Posted by JJ

This plate umpire is doing a GREAT job! Fun to watch, and a credit to his training. The game is good, too.

JJ

For the most part I agree, I feel his timing on off speed pitches causes him to decide the pitch before it crossed the plate. Positioning for the plays at the plate were excellent. His zone is too tight for me, and not consistent on the corners or on the breaking ball. Saying that though, he is the best I have seen so far, over all.

[Rich Ives]

Wasn't giving the high strike - both teams POed. Otherwise pretty good.

Up until now most have been complaining that the zones were too large.

Can't please some folks I guess,

[kylejt]

I'm not sure what game you fellas are watching. He wasn't consistent on balls and strikes the whole game.

The announcers were on him the whole game, and West coach belittled him on the field. It was awful.

[JJ]

Hmm...I thought his mechanics were solid, and I thought his positioning was good, and his timing was better than most of the LL umpires I saw in this tournament. Balls and strikes? Coaches and players PO'd? Heck, those folks are upset most of the time during a game, depending on how they're doing.
So much for trying to compliment a hard working umpire. I won't make that mistake here again.

JJ

[EsqUmp]

I thought that he did a pretty dreadful job. He missed at least three dozen pitches that could have been called strikes. Thought there is room for some deviation, how is it that with him behind the plate the number of pitches per inning more than doubled per pitcher? Not 3 or 4 pitches, but an increase from around 13 to around 27? That's absolutely ridiculous. There were at least a dozen pitches that were strikes in ANY umpire's zone, which were called balls.

He seemed more focused on pleasing the spectators by doing things like showing the count every single pitch (which didn't help him when he gave the batter 1st base on ball three). He also had an egregious "swinging" third strike where the West player's bat barely came off of his shoulder (bases loaded - inning over!).

It was also great how he would say, "ball, no swing" all the time, only to go for help on the checked swing. Was he trying to convince the base umpires that he was right?

With regard to game management, he didn't appear to have much there either. Players and coaches (at least the one I could understand) were on him all game and he didn't address it once. The players antics and demonstration of displeasure with his zone is understandable, but not acceptable and he never seemed to address it.

Unfortunately, I didn't anticipate a 3 hour game so my DVR cut off going into the 6th inning

[briancurtin]

Originally Posted by EsqUmp

It was also great how he would say, "ball, no swing" all the time, only to go for help on the checked swing. Was he trying to convince the base umpires that he was right?

I thought that was a fairly standard thing, although myself and most others I know would say "ball, no he didn't"

[Rich]

Originally Posted by briancurtin

I thought that was a fairly standard thing, although myself and most others I know would say "ball, no he didn't"

"Ball. No, he didn't go."

I say this every time I have a check swing where I judge the batter didn't offer. Means nothing other than I thought he didn't go. Isn't meant to give a message to anyone other than that.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by Rich

"Ball. No, he didn't go."

I say this every time I have a check swing where I judge the batter didn't offer. Means nothing other than I thought he didn't go. Isn't meant to give a message to anyone other than that.

I was recently taught to not say anything but "Ball." If you say something afterward like, "He didn't go," or "No he didn't," then you're definitively stating that you saw no swing, and you shouldn't subsequently go for help when asked.

[briancurtin]

Originally Posted by Manny A

I was recently taught to not say anything but "Ball." If you say something afterward like, "He didn't go," or "No he didn't," then you're definitively stating that you saw no swing, and you shouldn't subsequently go for help when asked.

Correct, I am definitively stating that I saw no swing, because I didn't. You first need to judge the pitch as it pertains to the zone (you have a ball), and then you need to determine if he swung (he didn't). Why hide the fact that you think he didn't go? If U1/U3 turn it over and say he did, no big deal.

Anyways, NCAA 3.6.f says get help when they ask, so I'm asking if they're asking. "ball, no he didn't" - "can you check?" - "Bob, did he go?" - "yes he did" - "ok we have a 2-2 count here" -- simple.

If I didn't definitively know, I'd check with a base umpire right away.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by briancurtin

Correct, I am definitively stating that I saw no swing, because I didn't. You first need to judge the pitch as it pertains to the zone (you have a ball), and then you need to determine if he swung (he didn't). Why hide the fact that you think he didn't go? If U1/U3 turn it over and say he did, no big deal.

Anyways, NCAA 3.6.f says get help when they ask, so I'm asking if they're asking. "ball, no he didn't" - "can you check?" - "Bob, did he go?" - "yes he did" - "ok we have a 2-2 count here" -- simple.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that it shouldn't be a big deal. It's just what I've been recently told.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by JJ

Hmm...I thought his mechanics were solid, and I thought his positioning was good, and his timing was better than most of the LL umpires I saw in this tournament. Balls and strikes? Coaches and players PO'd? Heck, those folks are upset most of the time during a game, depending on how they're doing.
So much for trying to compliment a hard working umpire. I won't make that mistake here again.

JJ

Then why did you add a rolls eyes at the end.

I disagreed with your entire first post ... agreed with the rolls eyes. This guy was awful, but I've been trained to expect this over the last 2 weeks.

[Chris_Hickman]

From what I understand the ump who called the previous game had a zone the size of a 65" plasma tv. His is typical. I am sure this plate guy saw the previous game and he told himself " there is no way I am calling a game like that!" So he over compensated and was tight. I saw some of the game. He was tight. That is human nature. He did over umpire. Gave the count waaaay too much. If you have 10 other umps calling a huge zone and 1 ump who calls a descent zone you are still gonna make players and coaches unhappy. Btw, I have been making players and coaches unhappy for 15 years!!!!! At least I have that going for me....

[PeteBooth]

The one "thing" we do not know is how these umpires are instructed.

I cannot remember anyone getting tossed in the LL Regionals or LLWS and there were some actions that warrented it.

If you remember the Danny Almonte era, there was a player on the Bronx team who hit an HR and taunted the other team all the way around the bases. Even his own coach said he probably should have been EJ'd.

There was a coach many years back who made a mockrey by not allowing one of his players to get the minimum one at bat requirement and took a forfeit. I think it was a coach from Indiana if memory serves and nothing happened.

I could go on and on which leads me to believe that these umpires are SPECIFICALLY instructed not to toss anyone.

As far as the strike zone goes these "guys / gals" can't win. It's either too liberal or too tight.

Pete Booth

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

As far as the strike zone goes these "guys / gals" can't win. It's either too liberal or too tight.

A) This is something all umpires live with... But that said -
B) There is a HUGE amount of space between the finals guy's "too small" and the semi-finals guy's "too large" Neither of these two zones were acceptable in anyone's book.